Lambone

For anyone intersted... Ryan's memorial service was held in Lake Tahoe this last weekend. It was amazing to see over 1000 people congregate to celebrate his life. It was also very tear jerking. Anyway, there is a pretty cool video about Ryan's life, photos of his childhood, hucking huge cliffs, El Cap, and his last days on his wakeboard. It gives you a glimpse of the person he was. Go to: http://rockofroseville.org click on his photo, and then the video link. Takes a minute to load and is about 5 minutes long. There are also some words from his father and their close family friend that were spoken at the memorial. I'm not sure I agree with the message they are trying to get across, but it is an interesting perspective on extreme sports and risk. Thanks.

I agree...I've started mt biking alot lately, and it has improved my desire to get out and rock climb. Plus it's fun and good for the lungs.

So...wait to rent Matrix Revolutions? I hope Lord of the Rings doesn't suck...

Just to repeat whats been said... The Grip on the Prophets is the same as the Cobras. The Rages, Shrieks, and Vipers all have smaller grips. But the Vipers are ergonomically shaped...

If you are in Spokane, I would head to Montana. Check out the Montana Ice guide book. It is week compared to the New Washingto guide, but has some cool photos. Glacier has some massive ice. The mission range has cool stuff too. I believe Ski Sports lives in Missula now and is looking for partners, thats only a few hours from you.

Sweet, much fresh snow, any slide activity?

Alpinist Magazine... Colin's old trip reports... Photos of El Cap... Kill your Television...

lots of bent shaft CFBP's on ebay Although I have been looking for a staright shaft CFBP for a while now and it seems they are being horded.

The grip is smaller and tapers. It is skinny at the top and gets slightly larger towards the bottom, you can see it in photos. Loren thinks there are some design problems, but I disagree. He reviewed them on mtncomunity.org The Quarks are good, too bad the leashes, hammer, and picks suck ass, otherwise I would have considered them. The new BD Fusion rocks domes over the Ergo.

I have a pair. I replaced my Cobras with them. I like them better than the cobras for a few reasons, better grip for my hand, more clearence in the shaft, they are lighter and feel more balanced to me, and the Viper Fang option. But there are some disadvantages compared to Carbon Fiber. The Cobras are damp and heavier, so less swings to get good sticks and less vibration. I havent noticed any flex in the shaft. But I''m fairly small and lightweight...sort of. A buddy of mine who does some hardcore mixed climbing through horizontal caves and shit said he could feel the shaft flex. But I believe in that scenario you are putting alot more torque on the tool than if climbing a waterfall. If you like leashless climbing, but can't afford two sets of tools, I think the Viper is THE tool. Which is why I have them. Also, I am a fan of the Android leash. It is not for the Alpine... Hope that helps!

When the hell did I ever say that. I thanked you for giving me a run on one of your fucking top ropes that you had strung all over Marble. Gro a sack and buy some ice screws instead of stealing them from others...

sweet, at least I'm a master at something... so that must mean that you like to watch guys masturbate...right?

Here is a little story I just wrote to Will, about why I carry a hamer on wall climbs with a C3+F rating... ...It is too bad Zodiac gets labeled the easiest Captain route even though it has 8 C3 pitches. Tangerine Trip is much easier with only 3 or 4, but it is a scarier route because it is steep right off the deck. Zodiac is pretty much doomed to be beaten and clogged up by gumbies for years to come. I felt pretty fortunate to have it all to myself this July, it was sweet. Were thoxse fixed beaks still up on pitch 8? Did you lead that one? Those were pretty scary... I say the Trip is pretty easy, but...I did the hardest aid I've done yet on it. On Pitch 4 there is a section of fixed mank that was non existant, only blown deadheads...like an idiot I backcleaned up to that section because I was linking 3 and 4, had henoius drag, and was running out of biners and slings. Well...I got up to the start of the real fixed section, which when I did it before had like 5 or 6 pieces (rurps, mank heads, and a bad bolt). All of them were gone except the first piece. So there I was, a thirty foot run out, hanging off a 2mil piece of tat chord laced through a rusty old rurp. Staring up at nothing but blankness...a few broken heads, rurps with no sling, a chopped bolt...nothing. I spent about 30 minutes top stepping cutting broken tat out of a rurp eye with my swiss, and trying to thread a thin wire through a rurp eye. No go, it wouldn't get the fuck in there. I was starting to pucker....and it was getting dark. So I called for the pins, only problem was we left the tag line (and the cheater stick ) on the ground, so all we had was the haul rope. Since I was allready past the 100ft mark, my bro had to untie and tie the slack of the led line to the haul. I could barely pull up the pins and hammer...I was worked. Finaly I got them, somehow the rope reached. Three bottomed peckers later and I hit the bomber bolt, I lowered to back clean the peckers and plucked each one out with my fingers. I figure I was looking at at least a 60 footer. I don't think I could have down climbed, because I had topped stepped on bad gear and backcleaned to get where I was. Without those peckers I was fucked. Anyway, that is why I think it is smart to bring a back up plan. gimhlick is full of shit.

THAT MEANS THAT I THINK THAT THE PLACEMENTS ON C3 ARE OFTEN BODY WEIGHT ONLY. WHY WOULD YOU BOUNCE TEST THEM? OFTEN THEY JUST RIP WITHOUT STRESSING YOUR INTESTINES ENOUGH TO CAUSE YOU TO PASS GAS PAST YOUR PYLORIC VALVE. WHO GIVES A HOOT WHICH ONE FAILS WHEN YOU GIVE IT A BOUNCE TEST? I CARE WHICH ONE GETS ME TO WHERE I'M GOING WITHOUT SUBJECTING MYSELF TO A FALL ONTO A STATIONARY OBJECT OR INTO A CORNER OR OVER A ROPE CUTTING SHARP EDGE. SPACE IS OKAY. You don't bounce test C3 gear... you must be tough. I'm not talikng about SPACE, I know the differance. I'm talking about big ledges and death spikes. Like the one that poor bastard fell onto this summer. His partner lowered him down 7 pitches off the route. I didn't have a partner to do that for me, neither did ricardo....so we used pins to protect the pitch. That is what I'm talking about here. GREAT, NOW SPRAY LIKE YOU TEACH!!!!! I'll spray whaterver the hell I want thankyou very much. DON'T YOU THINK YOUR APPROACH WAS A GOOD ONE? WHY NOT ADVOCATE IT? I do. THE REALLY STRONG GUYS AND GIRLS ARE GOING TO FIGURE OUT NAILING WITHOUT READING THIS STUFF. LONGS' BOOK AND HELP FROM A FRIEND WILL DO THE TRICK. FOLKS READING THIS STUFF SHOULD BE OUT CLEAN CLIMBING UNTIL THEY GET SAFELY SHUT DOWN ON SOMETHING TOUGHER THAN ZODIAC. huh? AND I THINK RICARDOS POOR STYLE NAILING WAS OFFSET BY HIS VISION, AND MENTAL AND PHYSICAL STRENGTH TO MAKE HIM NEITHER A HERO NOR A ZERO, BUT INSTEAD ABOUT AVERAGE FOR HIS LEVEL OF GUMPTION. HE PROBABLY FUCKED UP IN HIS EUPHORIC STUPOR REGARDING THE GEAR TROPHIES. WHAT DO YOU THINK? I don't understand that statement, sorry. I don't think he fucked up anything, I think he did what he had to, he was smart...and I feel the same way about myself. Did you read his TR? YOU THINK RISKING A WHIP INTO SPACE IS MORE SERIOUS, STUPID OR NAIVE THAN HIGHBALL BOULDERING OR SOLOING 5TH CLASS MOUNTAIN ROUTES? I am talking about apples, you are talking about oranges. Lets talk about that 5th class solo on a mountain route. Just because someone soloed it, does that mean I shouldn't use a rope to match his style? I am not going to compare bouldering with big wall climbing, that is rediculous. IT TAKES A LOT LONGER. Bullshit YOU THINK YOU DIDN'T LEARN PROPERLY? BULL. Yes, I learned to use pitons 2000ft up the Shield. Did I do it properly, no. I was scared and overdrove many of the pins. I'm saying this is the wrong way to do it. SO KNOWING WHAT IS A KEY PLACEMENT FOR PERSONNEL PROTECTION DOESN'T FACTOR INTO YOUR PHILOSOPHY? What? It is exactly what I am talking about. If this pin is going to keep me off that ledge should my HB Brassy blow higher above, give me the hammer. I THINK YOU HAVE TO SEPARATE "POINTS OF PROTECTION" Pitons that have more holding power to keep you from decking on a ledge. HMMM....CAN YOU DRAW A PARALLEL BETWEEN ENCOURAGING FOLKS TO STRIVE FOR SUPERHUMAN HARD FREE CLIMBING GOALS AND ENCOURAGING NORMAL PEOPLE TO STRIVE FOR REALLY HARD CLEAN AND RELATIVELY SAFE AID CLIMBING GOALS./OBJECTIVES????? Yes, but people set their own goals. And I'm not telling anyone what to do. I'm just telling you my philosophy. YOUR ONTO THAT JOKE, BUT THEN YOU JUST IMPLIED IT'S A SHAME THAT PORTER'S ROUTE IS GONE. DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE NEXT LINE WOULD YA. HELP DRAW THE LINE IN THE SAND BETWEEN WHAT IS OKAY AND WHAT IS LAME. Fine, what is lame is when people nail pins into cracks that can safely go clean. Cracks that risk bad fall potential regardless of what fancy clean gear you have should be protected with a pin. I THINK YOU OUGHT TO GET BACK A LITTLE CLOSER TO WILL. Will hammerd his own piton in probably the same place that I did. So I think we are pretty close. He bitched t ricardo for nailing more pins than he did, and I think that is just stupid. Will and I are friends, and have discussed this in private. SO AM I....EXCEPT THAT YOU ARE ENCOURAGING OTHERS TO DO IT WHEN YOU KNOW IT ISN'T NECESARY. No, I am not. I am saying that if pins are necesary to prevent injury or the potential of having your ass rescued off the cliff. It is not worth putting your life in dange, or the lives of resuers in danger of a little granite dust and a broken ego. My spray point/question was really simple. Is IT better SPRAY style to adovocate clean climbing and to encourage folks to LEAVE the freaking hammer back home? DEPENDS WHAT ROUTE YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. THE NOSE, THE WEST FACE OF LEANING TOWER. THAN YES, ZODIAC...I DON'T THINK SO. I THINK LEAVING THE HAMMER BEHIND IS FOOLISH. KNOWING WHEN IT APPROPRIOTE TO USE IT IS IMPORTANT PART. SOME DO, SOME DON'T, I BELIEVE THAT I DO. Okay, I really do think your are a puss for bringing a hammer on your solo climb of Zodiac too. GREAT Especially with all of your experience. EXPERIENCE IS WHAT TAUGHT ME TO BRING IT. Step up! FUCK OFF, I'LL CLIMB HOW I LIKE. If I were Socretes.... I CALLED YOU SOCRATES BECAUSE HE HAD THAT ANNOYING TENDENCY TO TURN EVERY STATEMENT INTO A QUESTION. I guess i need to find and read the glacier peak story...does that explain your conversion to a born again nailer? NO, I SOLOED EL CAP AND REALIZED THAT SOMEONE HAD CLEANED ALL THE FIXED GEAR THAT I WOULD NEED TO MAKE A CLEAN ASCENT OF THE NAILING ROUTE CALLED ZODIAC. IT'S BEEN FUN, BUT I AM SICK OF BEATING THE DEAD HORSE, AND I'M SURE OTHERS ARE TOO.

I agree with Paco.

sorry, I'd rather spray about aid climbing then polotics or some other BS.

It sounds like a good coat for skiing on cold days or nights. But I think I'd get too hot climbing in it.

Thats ok, we didn't thake a hammer and pins on Glacier Peak...only a cell phone. Call me a pussy...see if I care...

Cody kicks ass, best waterfall ice climbing in the Lower 48 and no-one goes there. Also check Don Foot's web site, he hosts the anual Cody Ice Fest. It is a great time, I'd recomend going. It is only 3-4 hours past Bozeman and the routes blow Hyalite away. Plus you don't need a burly truck to get in there. http://southforkice.com/

ummm..what the fuck is that supposed to mean? I am starting to think that either you haven't done much aid climbing, or haven't hammered many pitons. Two taps on a sawed off in a typical Yosemite pin scar is usually all you need to get a bomber bodyweight placement. Lots of times you don't even need to hammer the pin at all, just shove it in there... Look Socrates, I have taught a bunch of aid climbing courses, and taught several of my friends how to aid climb. Not once in that process did a hammer ever appear, not once was it ever advocated that they should invest in a hammer or pitons at first. I have personaly only nailed pitons on three aid climbs that I have done. I climbed only clean routes for 6 or 7 years before I nailed my fist pin on an aid route (mountains not included). Beginner wall climbers are going to contiune to get on the Zodiac, and that is fine. It is often considered the esiest route on El Cap. If I were coaching a first timer who was jumping on the Zodiac, I would advise them to climb some obscure line and learn to pound a good pin and head where it won't piss anyone off. People getting on a route like Zodiac should know how to use a hammer and pound a piton without over driving it, as well as place copperheads. If they don't then they are either kidding themselves, or resigning to learn the hard way when they need to. These skills are part of the game of wall climbing. Zodiac is a route that can be climbed clean, but everyone knows that a clean ascent is highly relient on fixed gear. Should that gear not be there and you want to finish the route, then you will need a hammer, it is as simple as that. If people don't want to be exposed to this risk then they should do the Nose, Salathe, or Tripple Direct. Even Lurking Fear, but then you still might need a head or two. Personally I would rather see people learn to use pitons properly before jumping on any El Cap route that might need a piton. I speak from my own inexperience here. People who have never aided on their own pitons tend to bash the hell out of them, either fixing them, or creating alot of damage when trying to clean them. You also seem to thing I'm advocating nailing pins in offset alien placements or bomber cam hook placements that will hold 99% of the time. No, wrong...you and I arn't even talking about the same thing here...do you have any idea what I am talking about? Lastly, to claim that the Zodiac is in some sort of "natural state" is to admit that you haven't climbed it recently. It is a contrived clip-up, no more no less. It's natural state is old school A5 Charlie Porter Style. Now it is covered in bolts and big fat trenched head placements, which is a whole 'nother issue. The Hubers free climb is a squeeze job with new bolts and anchors all over the place to the right and left of the route. They had to remove a bunch of bomber fixed heads to use the dug out trenches as finger pockets. To call that anything resembeling a "natural state" is just a load of crap. People arguing over the preservation of the Natural Beauty of the Zodiac are really a joke in my opinion. No matter what anybody thinks, people from around the world are going to continue nailing a hand full of beat out pin scars until they take 1.5 inch angles, just like the Shield. Yeah I wish it was different, but thats reality. Either way you argue the point people will allways disagree with you, I used to be a clean-aid nazi...going about like Will, slamming other people for nailing pins on routes that go clean. And I got twice as much shit for that...so now I am admitting that I had to pound some pitons and that I don't feel too bad about it, I wish I had been able to do it clean, but I made a decision and I'm fine with it. If some gumby wants to take that as their own excuse to go nail on clean routes than so be it...nobody is perfect. Sorry I am so grumpy, but it is late...

Ok dude, first of all... I am not encouraging new aid climbers to do jack shit. This is the spray forum, and as far as I am aware of this discussion has been amongst a bunch of experienced people, I am merely spraying my opinion. I don't teach new aid climbers to go aid climbing with a hammer, never have, never will...ask iceguy. Who do you think I am chalanging here? I am not telling anyone to do anything...If ricardo had come to me and asked me if he should solo Zodiac fo his first wall, I would have said no. Not, hell yeah dude just bring a bunch of pins! Second, I climbed every aid route I did at Index without a hammer, and rappeled each one to get down, mostly solo. Is this uncommon? Third, I'm not sure I understand this question. But let me try and answer. Soloing El Cap this summer was not at all about "scoring the Zodiac" as if it would be some notch in my belt. I had already done the route...clean. I solo aid climb for the experience of being alone and selfsufficient on a big cliff. I like the satisfaction of doing all the work by myself, and getting to lead every pitch. I have rapped off of El Cap several times, from up to the 1000ft mark. I don't relish the thought of doing it again, and I don'tmake it part of my strategy to go up there unprepared with the option of rappeling down. in my opinion rappleling off of big walls is saved for those emergencies when you have no choice, or your damn partner is flaking out and would rather be boneing their girlfriend. One of the first thngs I learned about big walls came from John Longs book, where he says that rappeling off a wall is the most dangerous thing a big wall climber can do. And if some first time wall climber asks me if they should chose bailing if they get stopped half way up the Zodiac, or bringing pitons, I am going to tell them to bring the damn pitons. Do I manage risk when I climb? If I am interpereting your question correctly: HELL YEAH, don't you? Or do you just freeball it up every route that you do with your nuts to the breeze fancyfree and laughing at death. For me managing my risks sometimes slamming an angle in when i'm reaching ground/ledge fall potential. Fuck yeah I evaluate and manage my risks, if you have a problem with that...well don't ever expect to rope up with me. Different priorities I guess...cheers

Is it just me or does anyone else think this logic is...like...dumb? Perhaps early American climbers didn't want their cracks to become strings of rusty pitons with broken eyelets like those you can find in Canada or Europe Personaly i think fixed gear is trash and climbers who don't or can't remove it to be incompitant (with the exception of bomber copperheads).

The new Oval Wire gates are pretty cool. If you are buying alot of extra biners for aiding I think they are worth it, you will get more biners for the $. Ovals have some huge benefits in some cases (racking pins, tieing clove hitches, the gaurda knotbrake rappel...etc), but for the emost part I like nutrinos. This should be in the Gear Critic...

Why should that be any different? It's worse in my perspective...who want's a route littered with abandoned fixed gear?