Lambone

Fleb, I remember a hand crack with solid holds upto a big ledge on the right. 5.7 maybe the ledge could hold snow for sure, probly in the shade most of the day.

once two years ago took a friend from Chicago up it as his first multi pitch and first "Alpine" climb. I had alot of fun on the climb, not hard obviously, but enjoyable.

Kurt, you get my vote for being the biggest macho-egotistical gorrilla brained fat ass hasbeen wanna-be climber asshole on this web site. Congratulations.

good luck frosty, that is the sketchiest piece of climbing gear I own. I wouldn't even give mine away for fear that it might get someone killed.

hmmm...ok fair enough kind of hard for me to appreciate since it's 70 degrees and sunny out my window right now... still think that wind would keep alot of that snow off the crest of the ridge which is where 90% of the climbing is.

Are you arguing that the crest of the ridge would take more than 1 good sunny day to dry out in the fall? I doubt it.

Give it a clear window to dry out, it doesn't take long to dry at all, maybe 1 or 2 clear days. I did the NR on October 27th last year and it was stellar. Crappy Disposable camera photo....

this is so true and if your not afraid at all being 500ft off the deck with nothing but air below you and not tied into the rope....then you need more help then we can offer.

In my opinion, the Gendarme is an easier finish then the variation, especialy if there is alot of ice down in there. If you take the Variation late season, you might want to take somwthing a little more heafty then a flyweight Ice axe.

whoa that's fucked up. good for him though...at least making an effort t improve his health...

Thanks Alex FYI- Accorindg to someone who claims to know on Supertopo.com...the offending Wilderness Power Driller arrested in the Rock Creek Wilderness, Ca. appears to be Urmas Franosch. Not sure how reliable that is... http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.html?m=43263&f=0&b=0

that is very sad....rockfal sucks.

is he climbing up a crack, or holding onto windowpanes or something?

I use the Gri-gri back up system. Yeah tex is right that it does make sliding your jugs up harder at first, but once your up a ways it works fine. saves time bbecause you don't have to mess with tieing knots and clipping them in, and you are backed up right there.... sometimes you have to stop and pull all the slack through the gri-gri...which can be a pain in the ass.

exactly

"yet you've done so at least twice in the last week." yeah, but not in this thread. I'm not afraid to admit that I'd like to know whether the founders of the WCC use power drills in the wilderness. I'll leave it at that. My assumtion due to the lack of denial is that at least some of them do. i'm not pointing fingers at anyone because I don't know for sure. But I tell you what, if I did know for sure...everyone else would know about it as well. So better not tell Lambone. Maybe I do have a $1,000 to donate...sure would want to make sure my money was going to a cause I support. have a nice day

That's a load of crap matt. I would repect your opinon, and your honesty. I may not agree with it. So far every post you have directed at me in this thread has in some way painted me out to be a bad person....when all I did was ask for your opinion., and you accuse me of throughing around insults. Who is really doing the insulting here matt? Let's say Dru says he thinks people should be able to use power drills anywhere. Fine, he has an argument that he's intitled to. Did I diss him for it, no...at least i don't think so....run some searches... My grievance with you specificaly, is that you'd come into this thread debating...as you did, on page 3, call out people on their opinions and through a bunch of backhanded questions to them. Yet when someone flat out asks you where you stand regarding the issue being discussed, you plead the 5th and play the I'm in the WCC so I can't vioce an opinion card. I have good friends and partners who have power drilled in the Wilderness in the past. they are still my friends. I appreiate that they aren't afraid to let people know their beliefs. That's fine, doesn't mean I can't disagree with them and still be their friend.

yeah ok, I'm sorry I even mentioned the WCC...shouldn't have pulled it into this thread. I'll drop it because obviously there is not yet enough organization to make a definite stance, that's fine. Still think they will eventually need a position when it comes to negotiating with the FS.....call me crazy. But, I'll still attempt to figure out what mattp is all about, especialy when he engages in debates and starts asking other people questions. I don't feel he is above scrutiny just because of his involvement with the WCC. ok, got some work to do...it's been fun.

Thanks DC, spraying is fun...glad to see someone in the WCC crew can be a little more lighthearted about it then mattp. I didn't accuse the WCC of having a hidden agenda. Just trying top figure out that if that agenda is not hidden, why mattp won't share it, i only pick on mattp because until now he has been the only "WCC guy" participating in these cc.com discussions. As far as I can tell there are two possible agendas. Both for advocating climbers, and opening access. One working to change the current laws that restrict power drills in Wilderness. Or, the opposite. Still not sure where some people stand, but I'd like to thank folks like Bug, Dru, Willstricland, Merv, Caveman, etc...for at least being straight-up about how they feel, either for or against. Again, no one is under obligation to voice their opinion openly, that is why I started the poll. But if you come into the thread and start going on about this or that...better be ready to get off the fence. cheers

yeah dru, true dat. If that's their goal then they should strive for that. I'm not saying they shouldn't. What I am saying is that I'd want to know about it, so that I would not be a part of that effort to change the law.

ok chuck fair enough. but it's still getting off topic. I didn't ask for the WCC's stance initialy, I asked for mattp's stance, since he was engaging in the discussion/debate. still, more to your point....if the WCC even had to consider whether or not to support the Wilderness Act or not, and spend months establishing a concensus....this would be a deciding factor for me personaly. I'm not speaking for anyone else, or telling people how they should feel or what they should do, this is just where I'm coming from. If the goal of the WCC is to establish a good relationship with landmanegers through collective organization, then I don't understand the issue with saying, "Yes, we support the laws established by the Wilderness Act and the FS who enforces them." Right? That is...I guess, unless they DON'T? Which is what i'm trying to figure out.

that's cool Will I appreciate your help, but it's pretty obvious he won't. and you know what...that's fine, because that approach alone pretty much answers my question. Just don't gimme that "you keep picking fights" bullshit mattp. You came into this thread on your own will, and started debating, and now you don't want to respond to the questions being asked of you. Sorry, but if you don't like it, don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. almost half the voters would rat on a power driller. nice

that's bullshit Will, either they support the law or they don't. Take a stand, what kind of wishy washy group that is afraid to speak up against anything would expect to accomplish any goal whatsoever. and if the founders of the group are violators of this law themselves (maybe so, maybe not?) ...then I find it hard to support their cause. It's not fucking rocket science were talking about here. Edit: But that is much farther then i am even taking this here....I'm asking mattp for his personal opinon, not to speak for the WCC group. I understand if he wouldn't want to do that in this forum, makes sense. So where can I find the information, give me the link? Is there a link? If not I'd recommend the group creat one...one way or another.

Matt, I have simply been asking you questions here. I haven't made accusations, I haven't asked you if you have used a power drill in the Wilderness. I also haven't denied that you have done alot for the climbing community in Washington, but thanks for reminding me...or "beating your chest" about it...in your termenoligy. I simply asked you how you feel about this law in particular. You responed by basically saying it is not a big deal and other laws are more important...at least that's how I read into your reply. I'm sorry if you precieve that as an attack. You asked me about my opinion towards people who break laws in Yosemite and elsewhere, how come I can't ask you something? This issue is very real to me, is it not real to you? Personaly the preservation of Wilderness in this country for my children to enjoy would probly be the #1 most important real issue to me. When I first heard about the WCC I thought..hey cool idea, way to go. Then I inquired about the organizations stance on specific issues such as illegal wilderness bolting. Nothing, no reply. I asked several times in several different threads, and looked for information on the WCC web site. Still nothing. Personaly I like to investigate a group before I offer support to it, I want to know what they are about and where they stand on important issues. I think this is a fair enough inquiry, correct? So I'm sorry you take it as an attack on you personaly, but being a co-founder of this group I would expect that you'd be at least up front with people on where you stand. If you are not willing to be up front and open, then forget asking for my support to represent the climbing community. I apologize for calling you a chickenshit...that was a cheap shot, however I still feel that if your not willing to stand up for what you believe in and voice those beliefs openly....chickenshit may be a fitting title. That's all, have a nice day

good for him, I think that's bullshit. I don't really strive to command respect or much of anything else for that matter. Commanding people are lame. So far it looks like 44% of voters on this thread would chose to be part of the solution. No thanks. Should I also start soloing because Peter Croft does it? I prefer gear protcted Alpine routes, including belays.