Cables on your Pickets?

[KaiLarson]

What do folks think about cables on your pickets?

 

Do you like them? Not like them?

 

I've always just slung mine with a dynema sling, but am wondering if a cable would be easier and/or more secure.

 

I don't climb a ton of routes where I use pickets, so I'm hoping that folks on this board with more experience can chime in.

[montypiton]

I like to be able to alter the location of the sling on my pickets, so no cable, and no permanent sling - just sling them to match the placement -- e.g., sling will be at midpoint of shaft if picket is T-slotted, but will be at end of picket if pounded in vertically.

[tvashtarkatena]

There are three ways to place a picket (vert end clipped, vert mid clipped, deadman mid clipped), depending on the snowpack. Best to know 'em all:

 

Traditional, Sierra, and Horizontal Picket Placement

[Alan Trick]

I like a cable on a picket if I intend to use it mid-clipped vertically, since it cuts the snow cleaner and with less effort. I have both setups, but I generally prefer mid-clipped because it seems to be much more solid most of the time.

 

 

[tvashtarkatena]

One rule of thumb:

 

If you can't poke your bare finger through the snow (and it isn't just a thin surface crust) - vertical top clipped is fine.

 

If you can poke your finger through and but you can still make a decent snowball - vertical mid clip - then backfill and compact the trench. This can be as much as 3x stronger than vertical top clip in such conditions.

 

If you can't make a snowball at all - horizontal (deadman) is your only viable option.

Edited August 7, 2014 by tvashtarkatena

[keenwesh]

Yates makes a cable slung picket that works incredibly well. You can place it vertically (i.e. fast) but the cable slices through the snow and gives it deadman strength. I assume you could use regular pickets in this fashion but slings don't slice through the snow nearly as easily.

 

For the amount of use that you'll get out of pickets in the lower 48 I wouldn't worry about it that much. Learn how to make a bollard if you have to rap over a schrund and become comfortable climbing steep firm snow, I've rarely/never encountered steep facets around here.

 

http://yatesgear.com/climbing/ice/

[denalidevo]

After reading the research on vertical mid-clip pickets, I have pretty much switched exclusively to the Yates picket with a wire. When used properly they are quick to place (and so I am more likely to place them) and just as strong as a T-slot. They can always be used as T-slots and vertical top clips as well.

 

Link: http://arc.lib.montana.edu/snow-science/objects/ISSW_O-061.pdf

 

Yates makes a cable slung picket that works incredibly well. You can place it vertically (i.e. fast) but the cable slices through the snow and gives it deadman strength. I assume you could use regular pickets in this fashion but slings don't slice through the snow nearly as easily.

 

For the amount of use that you'll get out of pickets in the lower 48 I wouldn't worry about it that much. Learn how to make a bollard if you have to rap over a schrund and become comfortable climbing steep firm snow, I've rarely/never encountered steep facets around here.

 

http://yatesgear.com/climbing/ice/

[tvashtarkatena]

For anyone wanting to add a wire to a picket -

 

Yate's uses 5/32" cable - 2250 lbs. 42" eye to eye.

 

Given that a well placed deadman will blow at 1500 lbs, you can get away with 1/8" cable (1750 lbs)

 

Stainless cable with (properly) crimped Cu swage (don't use Al) will give you 90% of that - just over 1500 lbs.

 

For T cross section pickets - you'll want to use an eye sleeve on the picket end of the cable to keep it from slicing through the aluminum. The biner on the other end has a larger diameter - not so much of an issue there.

 

You can used galvanized cable with Al (don't use Cu) swages, but the Al will reduce overall strength a bit more.

 

Fisherman's Supply in Seattle has the goods, BTW.

Edited August 8, 2014 by tvashtarkatena