pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Quote
pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Quote
pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. I think Joseph that your negativity has done more to generate animosity towards Beacon Rock policies then the policies themselves, and it does not become you nor does it benefit the Park or the climbers. You act like a Ranger towards the climbers, and a climber to the rangers, when in fact you are neither. Â I THINK U JUST HIT THE PROVERBIAL NAIL ON THE HEAD Quote
sobo Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 Hey Sobo, what time is it? I don't know what to say... simply at a loss for words here... :shakinghead: Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 I think Joseph that your negativity has done more to generate animosity towards Beacon Rock policies then the policies themselves, and it does not become you nor does it benefit the Park or the climbers. You act like a Ranger towards the climbers, and a climber to the rangers, when in fact you are neither. Well, from your posts of late I'd say you're fitting right into the WhineClub posse - continually misinterpreting what's said, proffering one dripping line of victimal tripe after another, and spewing shit you can't back up with facts. Â First, you clearly have no idea of the history of animosity towards Beacon Rock policies or you wouldn't says something as blatantly stupid as your first statement. What doesn't benefit the climbers is their abject cluelessness and relentless childishness in thinking ANYONE recognizes, cares or sympathizes with the heinous injustices visited upon poor Beacon locals. NOTHING will ever change the closure absent FACTS to support FORMAL POLICY CHANGES. So long as you guys are this remarkably dense on that point there is nothing I can say or do that has any impact on you clowns at all - nothing changes in WhineClub's thinking regardless of what anyone says, least of all me. And nothing I say here has the slightest impact on the park or BRSP - they gave up thinking a couple of you might actually come around two head rangers ago and the new one likely isn't holding his breath. Â And name one instance of me 'acting like a ranger' other than foolishly being willing to talk to and listen to what the various agency personnel who run Beacon actually have to say? Tooling around as it were no doubt - a violation of the first rule of WhineClub. I don't 'act towards climbers' in any way other than to call a spade a spade. As for not being a climber - right on dude, say that to my face at the high anchor on Menopause if you can get to it. If you mean I'm not a member of WhineClub - damn straight, I'd slit my wrists first. From the Cannon to JT and half the crags in between I've never run into a crew of guys so intent on whining about their plight while at the same time so completely unwilling to do anything about it besides whine louder. Â Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Look, you are under the mistaken impression I give a rats ass at this point or am interested in climbing or socializing with this crew. It's a lame social club of pathetic whining and imaginary 'bad boys' largely divorced from actual climbing these days. OH MY GOD WE ARE SO OPPRESSED!!! But are a single one of you prepared to do anything real about it? It's nothing more than a smack-talking, neo-nostalgic, feel-good circle jerk behind a rock when it comes to any aspect of interacting with the policies, agencies and people who manage Beacon. When you get right down to it the number one priority is clearly whining, not climbing. Quote
pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 joseph is a COMMUNIST!!!!!!! what is ur best accomplishment as a climber tough guy? Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 so joseph , if u could put together a super group of joe homo group of rock climbers together at beacon. who would it be??? obviously everyone at beacon is lame, RIGHT???? what's ur idea of the stone masters that u would like to stand behind u and your ideas??? Again, I'm not really the manclub type so I don't really do the group love thing. And 'my ideas'? Dude, get a grip - my only 'idea' having been a journalist was to objectively look at the existing paperwork trail, interview everyone involved (climbers and agency folk), learn the biology, learn the laws / regs / policies, sort out where the power lies among all the various BRSP stakeholders, sort out who does what in their jobs, and try to figure out what can legally be done about the closure. That was the only 'idea' I had. Â And the results of that 'idea'? Â A) Beacon climbers had burned every shred of credibility they ever had between bullshit stunts, childish behavior breaking the closure, inadvisable actions on mass cleaning, and relentless smack talk about the agency folks. Â B) Beacon climbers side of the story and myth in almost every salient event in the timeline was almost invariably shrouded in, or packed with, half-truths, never-happeneds, and out-right lies. Â C) Beacon climbers demanded a full closure when a provisional partial closure was offered to them. Â D) That there are very limited legal options for doing much of anything about the closure before about 2015 other than monitoring the Peregrines for early opens or the chance that they'll nest elsewhere either on or off the rock so the South Face can be opened. No monitoring? Then neither of those is going to happen with the current manpower, workload, and budget issues at WDFW - it wasn't happening between '00-'04 and wouldn't have been happening since without some climber dogging the status week-by-week. Â E) That in the end, law, regs, and policy all end up interpersonal politics when they hit the ground day in, day out. You avoid relationships with agency personnel at your peril. And when you 'want' something, no one is particularly interested when they know the bottom line is you're slagging them the minute their back is turned and just making shit up out of thin air to support 'your side' of the story - make that your 'myth'. Â My ideas? Learn the law before attempting to change it; sort out who holds the keys; establish a relationship with them; put in some time, energy, and funds to demonstrate tangible investment by locals to try and reestablish at least the shred of credibility necessary for the agencies to listen to what a climber might think or have to say. Do I need any other climber to embrace them? Nope, not a one at this point - I get my climbing in. Â Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and a Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't like what I say or the way I say it? Too fucking bad. But look at the bright side, you have something else to whine about. Â Do you locals need to embrace 'my ideas'? Nope, you're completely free to stay heads down in the WhineClub fairlyland for perpetuity. Just don't be surprised when no one takes your seriously when you 'want' something. Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 You just keep that keyboard sparkling with brilliance Andrew - you're almost starting to dazzle me. Quote
pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 so joseph , if u could put together a super group of joe homo group of rock climbers together at beacon. who would it be??? obviously everyone at beacon is lame, RIGHT???? what's ur idea of the stone masters that u would like to stand behind u and your ideas??? Again, I'm not really the manclub type so I don't really do the group love thing. And 'my ideas'? Dude, get a grip - my only 'idea' having been a journalist was to objectively look at the existing paperwork trail, interview everyone involved (climbers and agency folk), learn the biology, learn the laws / regs / policies, sort out where the power lies among all the various BRSP stakeholders, sort out who does what in their jobs, and try to figure out what can legally be done about the closure. That was the only 'idea' I had. Â And the results of that 'idea'? Â A) Beacon climbers had burned every shred of credibility they ever had between bullshit stunts, childish behavior breaking the closure, inadvisable actions on mass cleaning, and relentless smack talk about the agency folks. Â B) Beacon climbers side of the story and myth of almost salient every event in the timeline was almost invariably shrouded in, or packed with, half-truths, never-happeneds, and out-right lies. Â C) Beacon climbers demanded a full closure when a provisional partial closure was offered to them. Â D) That there are very limited legal options for doing much of anything about the closure before about 2015 other than monitoring the Peregrines for early opens or the chance that they'll nest elsewhere either on or off the rock. No monitoring? Then neither of those is going to happen with the current manpower, workload, and budget issues at WDFW - it wasn't happening between '00-'04 and wouldn't have been happening since without some climber dogging the status week-by-week. Â E) That in the end law, regs, and policy all end up interpersonal politics when they hit the ground day in, day out. You avoid relationships with agency personnel at your peril. And when you 'want' something, no one is particularly interested when they know the bottomline is you're slagging them the minute their back is turned and just making shit up out of thin air to support 'your side' of the story - make that myth. Â My ideas? Learn the law before attempting to change it; sort out who holds the keys; establish a relationship with them; put in some tangible in time, energy, and funds to demonstrate tangible investment by locals to reestablish at least the shred of credibility necessary for the agencies to listen to what a climber might think or have to say. Do I need any other climber to embrace them? Nope, not a one at this point - I get my climbing in. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and a fourth married one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't like what I say or the way I say it? Too fucking bad. But look at the bright side, you have something else to whine about. Â Do you locals need to embrace 'my ideas'? Nope, you're completely free to stay heads down in the WhineClub fairlyland for perpetuity. Just don't be surprised when no one takes your seriously when you 'want' something. Â another meaningless windbag retort....... i feel for u dude. Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 I'm positive all those noisy little words get especially meaningless the instant you realize they're true - the WhineClub issues inpenetrable reality distortion shields that protect you from anything smacking of that. And when all else fails, you move out of state where you also don't climb. Shine on dude, shine on - you're as local as the Internet. Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Don't believe what I say? Hey, there are three Beacon climbers who are lawyers and Kevbone is married to one - check with them and see if they say anything different or are willing to take on 'the man' over the closure. Â Quote
pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 I'm positive all those noisy little words get especially meaningless the instant you realize they're true - the WhineClub issues inpenetrable reality distortion shields that protect you from anything smacking of that. And when all else fails, you move out of state where you also don't climb. Shine on dude, shine on - you're as local as the Internet. Â Â yawn yawn....... so u r the beacon rock climbers association. nice too meet you Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 No, I keep telling you Andrew, I only speak for myself - I don't represent climbers in any way and tell all the agency folks that verbatim at this point. And trust me, I way prefer that to roping up with whiners. Quote
pink Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 No, I keep telling you Andrew, I only speak for myself - I don't represent climbers in any way and tell all the agency folks that verbatim at this point. And trust me, I way prefer that to roping up with whiners. Â Â well so, you only speak for yourself then, but yet you preach how climbers are unorganized with closures and how we need to speak as one as a group. dude, you r one lame group. you are a sad excuse for a climber and am thinkin you and billcoe are two peas in a pod. Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 It's pretty much a pointless exercise for Beacon climbers to organize for the sole purpose of whining as a group - no one will listen to them seriously for more than about 30 seconds and then they'll just nod their head for the rest of the meeting and pat them on their head on the way out the door. Â As it stands now the outcome of such a meeting would mostly be one of wonderment mixed with pity at the insular self-absorbtion of climbers and indignant sense of injustice they manage to maintain. They would also marvel at the complete lack of understanding of even the fundamentals of any aspect of managing a resource like Beacon Rock. Â No, I preach pulling your heads out of your asses and waking the fuck up. And that odd smell? That would be reality. Manage that and then sure, organize, learn a little bit so you don't sound completely clueless, and maybe even select some loser to be the BRCA spokesperson you'll likely ostracize later for talking and listening to and otherwise consorting with 'the man'. Â P.S. Bill is smart enough to not be in any pod I'm in; but hell, you'd know that if you were a local... Â Quote
ivan Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 And hey, I'll stay completely out of it here so no worries there. Â duuuuude... Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 Moof is the only one who has posted anything vaguely resembling a productive comment in this thread - I've made no comment at all on the substance of his comments. The only comment I've made on his post was due to the (intentional or unintentional) assertion the [bRSP] rangers abused or lied to anyone - a comment I wasn't going to let slide. Â Other than that I've only responded to comments and smack slung directly my way. Don't want me to respond here - don't aim shit my way. In fact, instead of shooting shit my way, maybe you guys should consider following Moof's lead and come up with some actual ideas of your own or at least respond to his ideas. Quote
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stevetimetravlr Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 Thanks Joseph. You just re-confirned everything that I said. Â Quote
JosephH Posted June 3, 2010 Author Posted June 3, 2010 Thanks Joseph. You just re-confirned everything that I said. You're welcome. After your recent cc posts I hate to find myself in any form of agreement with you on any topic. Quote
ivan Posted June 3, 2010 Posted June 3, 2010 i guess what i'm konfused by is where this is all comign from? who's been bitching lately? seems to me all the folks i know have made their peace w/ the birdies just fine and are continuing w/ life happy as can be - mostly i just see you chasing your tail, much to the delight of pink n' kev, while the whole world looks on w/ a bemused  i would like to bitch however about how my life is so busy right now i don't have time to sort through all da zion pix n' craft something crude n' wonderful out of it all.... Quote
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