Liberalism and Polygamy

[sexual_chocolate]

exactly. but then, by this definition, one man ramming an 18 inch black latex cock up another man's hersey-hiway would also be natural - and that makes the baby jesus cry....

 

oh jesus, he isn't the only one crying.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

the mindset is:

 

sterility is an act of god. the couple is still open to life, but circumstances BEYOND THEIR CONTROL prevent the new life. just because a couple is post menopausal doesn't mean they aren't open to life. it means they are past that stage in life.

 

hysterectomies are acts of god?

 

 

why'd they get an hysterectomy?

 

 

Shit, somehow Kevbone found out Underworld's login.

[sexual_chocolate]

the mindset is:

 

sterility is an act of god. the couple is still open to life, but circumstances BEYOND THEIR CONTROL prevent the new life. just because a couple is post menopausal doesn't mean they aren't open to life. it means they are past that stage in life.

 

hysterectomies are acts of god?

 

why'd they get an hysterectomy?

 

 

god told them to.

[underworld]

 

So you oppose artificial insemination or other types of fertility treatments for childless couples seeking to have a baby?

 

why not adopt?

 

It's not "natural" after all. And drugs to treat illnesses. Those are often synthetic, and not "natural", so we can't administer them to the sick?

 

ok, so natural might not be the best term... but helping the sick is preserving life.

[underworld]

the mindset is:

 

sterility is an act of god. the couple is still open to life, but circumstances BEYOND THEIR CONTROL prevent the new life. just because a couple is post menopausal doesn't mean they aren't open to life. it means they are past that stage in life.

 

hysterectomies are acts of god?

 

why'd they get an hysterectomy?

 

 

god told them to.

 

then i hope they heard him correctly...

[sexual_chocolate]

hey, god just told me to tell you to STFU!

 

And I heard him perfectly.

[underworld]

your mom!

[KaskadskyjKozak]

hey, god just told me to tell you to STFU!

 

And I heard him perfectly.

 

so much for you "cheeriness"... sun is gone, birds are no longer chirping.

 

[JayB]

probitions against polygamy are thoroughly retarded, provided they are formed between consenting adults - interesting that conservatives will "look the other way" on this "attack on marriage" though but still squeal like pigs if fags marry, eh?

 

Good point.

 

No, it's not a good point.

 

If you define marriage as "between a man and a woman" both gay marriage and polygamy are equally wrong.

 

Personally I'd like to see the state *out* of religious marriage, and religion *out* of civil unions. A church should not need a "marriage license" to wed a couple (or whatever) and the state should only define the legal contract bound between individuals (or groups thereof).

 

I agree with what you say if you treat the definition of what constitutes marriage (man + woman = marriage) as an axiom.

 

If you start to inquire as to the logical, legal, and moral basis that that particular axiom rests on - then I think it gets problematic. In our society, with the Constitution that we have - religious arguments for upholding this particular axiom simply aren't legitimate. I think that the notion of consent has a much stronger moral, legal, and philosophical basis - but that doesn't necessarily exclude polygamy.

 

It may be possible to make arguments against polygamy that are consistent with the principles established in the founding documents, but I haven't come across any that I can recall.

 

I'm with you on the state granting the legal rights - and the church or whatever organization you choose granting whatever blessing they choose to confer on the legal arrangement.

[sexual_chocolate]

hey, god just told me to tell you to STFU!

 

And I heard him perfectly.

 

so much for you "cheeriness"... sun is gone, birds are no longer chirping.

 

i said it with a big smile on my face, russkie boy.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

hey, god just told me to tell you to STFU!

 

And I heard him perfectly.

 

so much for you "cheeriness"... sun is gone, birds are no longer chirping.

 

i said it with a big smile on my face, russkie boy.

 

tsk, tsk, he's Bitter Cocoa Boy today.

 

 

[minx]

don't say bitter like its a bad thing

[KaskadskyjKozak]

don't say bitter like its a bad thing

 

Welcome back to the sandbox, Minx!

[minx]

thanks but i think i'm getting back out. its been a nice vacation

[KaskadskyjKozak]

thanks but i think i'm getting back out. its been a nice vacation

 

you scornful tease

[G-spotter]

On the subject of "natural", 90% of dolphin sex is gay sex.

Does Christ hate dolphins?

[KaskadskyjKozak]

On the subject of "natural", 90% of dolphin sex is gay sex.

 

thanks, Cliff

[minx]

On the subject of "natural", 90% of dolphin sex is gay sex.

 

thanks, Cliff

 

now who wants to bivy w/drew?

[ivan]

On the subject of "natural", 90% of dolphin sex is gay sex.

Does Christ hate dolphins?

funny - i remember reading chimps have similiar behavior, but then i already knew those buggers were evil...

[STP]

Some animals eat their young, too. Because it has a genetic and/or hormonal basis shouldn't justify the actions as socially conducive behavior.

 

For arguments sake, I'm just saying...

[lI1|1!]

On the subject of "natural", 90% of dolphin sex is gay sex.

Does Christ hate dolphins?

 

the dolphin Christ hates the gay dolphins only.

 

next.

 

 

[ivan]

Because it has a genetic and/or hormonal basis shouldn't justify the actions as socially conducive behavior.

funny - the researchers studying chimps found that all the gay sex they observed was EXACTLY for, if you'll pardon the unavoidable pun, lubricating the social network of the troop. male chimps suck off the troop's leader to indicate their submission and prevent conflict. all the females suck of the same alpha male (polygamous set-up?) for similiar reasons.

 

 

[sexual_chocolate]

hmmmm, interesting chimp behaviour that i didn't know about....

 

i've wondered why humanoids have such strong taboos against gay (mainly male) sex. i think there could be something here....

[ivan]

Paleoanthropology in the 1990's

Essays by James Q. Jacobs

 

A Comparison of Some Similar Chimpanzee and Human Behaviors

 

Bonobo Peace Keeping

Description: Aggressive behavior is typical of most primates. Gorillas, humans and chimpanzees kill members of their own species. The need for social and physical contact is also characteristic of most primates. Species that live in groups need to reconcile aggression. Social groups require some form of conflict resolution. Sexual behavior is one such mechanism to overwhelm aggression.

 

Bonobo sex life is divorced from reproduction and also serves the functions of pleasure and conflict resolution. Females are in a sexually attractive state most of the time, and almost continuously sexually active. Sexual activity is very frequent. Males, females and juveniles all engage in erotic activity. Age and gender are not sexual boundaries among the Bonobo. A typical sexual pattern is genital rubbing between adult females. Erotic contacts in Bonobos includes oral sex, genital massage and intense tongue-kissing.

 

Whereas in most other species sexual behavior is a fairly distinct category, in the Bonobo it is part and parcel of social relations. Sex seems to cement Bonobo bonds. Females use sex to form alliances against males. Consequently males do not dominate females or coerce them sexually. Bonobo culture is female-centered, egalitarian and substitutes sex for aggression.

 

Context: Bonobos live in groups of 50 to 120 animals. Bonobo society appears to be female-dominated. Male status is linked to that of his mother. Older females occupy the highest rank. The strongest social bonds are between females. Raising offspring is an exclusively female activity.

 

In Bonobo society sexual excitement and aggression rates are higher at feeding times. Dominant males may delay sharing food with females who are not sexually disposed. Cofeeding takes place between intimates. Among Bonobos, embracing, friendly touching and sexual contact rates jump after an aggressive incident. According to zoologist Frans de Waal, "The majority of mounts and matings occur in tense situations." "©onflict resolution is the more fundamental and pervasive function of Bonobo sex." Sex in Bonobo society is definitively a mechanism for keeping the peace.

 

Bonobo-Human Comparisons: Human nuclear families are presumably incongruous with the sex habits found in Bonobo culture. Many of the roots of human behavior can be traced to our primate heritage, including survival through cooperation and mutual assistance. While the same mechanisms and purposes may underlie Bonobo and human social behavior, distinct solutions have evolved in these two groups. In particular, humans and Bonobos have developed different mechanisms for peacekeeping. Cultural transmission and highly developed symbolic language are particularly unique to humans. Human conflicts and aggression are typically reconciled and avoided through language.

 

The use of sex to reconcile or avoid conflict is present in human culture, though it is nowhere near as pervasive a factor as among the Bonobos. Conflicts are less likely to recur after body contact between aggressors. This similarity to Bonobo use of sex can be seen in the custom of adversaries shaking hands after conflict, or close friends kissing and making up after a fight. Intimate human couples engage in sexual activity after conflicts. Sexual receptivity maintains pair bonding in humans much as it does group cohesion in Bonobos.

 

Unlike Bonobos, sexual control is evidenced in humans. Marriage typically serves as a sexual control mechanism. Human males participate in child rearing and, due to monogamous marriages, have some assurance of paternity. In most cultures men honor proprietary rights of husbands over their wife or wives. Marriage typically involves exclusion and control over a female's sexual life. Humans also demonstrate sexual coercion and jealousy between intimates. Most human cultures are male-dominated.

 

[ivan]

the best line from the work has got to be: "The majority of mounts and matings occur in tense situations."