Interesting Cordellette Study

[David Trippett]

Maybe posted before....but whatever....a good read.

 

http://www.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/High_Strength_Cord.pdf

 

This is not the first time I've heard that plain old nylon is best, just the first time I've seen any data. I've been using spectra....but I'm going back to 7mm nylon cord after I retire my present cordellettes.

[Blake]

cordellette are such a pain in the ass.... I think you almost h=always have a simpler solution.

[counterfeitfake]

cordellette are such a pain in the ass.... I think you almost h=always have a simpler solution.

 

Huh? The whole point of a cordelette is that it's simple and not a pain in the ass.

[G-spotter]

Sliding X

[David Trippett]

cordellette are such a pain in the ass.... I think you almost always have a simpler solution.

 

two bolts and sliding x.....so nice, I like!

 

[korup]

cordellette are such a pain in the ass.... I think you almost h=always have a simpler solution.

Yup. I carried one for a few seasons, huge bulky mess to deal with. With a 3 pt anchor, it is just as fast to equalize via runners. And anything more complex, you are going to spend a shitte-load of time building it anyway.... maybe on bad rock (Canadian Rockies?) where you need 4-5 pieces to feel marginal it is worth it. Otherwise, I'd rather have lots of flexible options via runners....

[catbirdseat]

I'll challenge you to equalize three pieces with your two slings faster than I can do it with my cordellette. The only exception would be three very closely spaced pieces that could be equalized with a single double length runner. And you can't do it faster using the rope either, at least not if you do it right.

[catbirdseat]

Maybe posted before....but whatever....a good read.

 

http://www.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/High_Strength_Cord.pdf

 

This is not the first time I've heard that plain old nylon is best, just the first time I've seen any data. I've been using spectra....but I'm going back to 7mm nylon cord after I retire my present cordellettes.

 

There are other reasons besides those in the Moyer report to use Nylon rather than high strength cord. These have to do with distribution of force among anchor points as described by Long in his new anchors book.

[mdidriksen]

You might find this of interest (hope this works):

Gunks.com cordalette discussion

[David Trippett]

Cordellette may not be lDEAL for all applications....but what it may lose in terms of perfect equalization it regains in terms of its over-all versatiity....I use it for slinging massive blocks when the rope can't do it, I use it as a prussick, cut it when I need cord for v-threads, as a tag line for pieces when short fixing and cut it up and leave it behind when I need rap anchors....with the exception of a couple bolts to slap a sling on....it is quite fast....and when the equalization is bothering me it can be made dynamic quite easily.

 

When I start seeing the big runners, webolettes and various gizmos being touted as ideal solutions I have to take issue with how single purpose a lot of that stuff is....If you're really worried about your anchors you should maybe take a course (not meant as a smart-ass remark, but as an earnest suggestion).

 

No anchor is perfect. The overall utility of a system in terms of speed, versatility and safety are my main considerations. The cordellette satisfies many of those requirements readily, though not ideally. anyhoo...I don't really mean to tout the cordellette....when something more useful comes along I'll switch....

 

blahblahblah.....

 

 

 

 

 

[Off_White]

The cordelette is one of those new fangled things I just haven't gotten around to checking out. I get stuck in the rut of what seems to work for me, and just don't make the time to add new things to the repertoire. I still tie in with a figure 8, tie my rappel ropes together with a double fishermans, have never used a GPS, and appreciate the value of a good hip belay. That's not to say that old ways are necessarily better, maybe it's just that I'm a little simple, but I do like having some things hardwired into my system that I can do intuitively without thinking about it much.

[David Trippett]

whoa! you "tie in"?! You must be a fossil!

 

Get with it man.....today it's freesolo the route, base jump the descent and get home in time to spray about it on the internetsweb before the lads head home from work.

[Off_White]

You hit the nail right on the head. You'll see, tricouni nails will make a comeback, just like retro nerds who are proud to use 300 baud modems.

[David Trippett]

post deleted for lameness

Edited June 10, 2007 by avitripp

[Drederek]

Called for and got a hip belay yesterday! I can't think of more than half dozen times in 20 years of rock climbing where a cordelette would have made my anchor safer. Maybe its just my age but I like things simple.

[crazy_t]

Hey "old schoolers", try bringing a cordelette with you on your next few multi-pitch climbs, it's simple, safe, versatile, and easy to rig a few different ways per the situation "without thinking too much". Don't let the frenchy name throw you off, it will make your life easier, and often safer. Fits into the "speed=safety" angle as well.

[genepires]

"like to keep things simple"? What could be more simple than a 15 to 20 feet of 7mm? Oh yeah, spending time trying to get wads of slings to work out. Or trying to tie a wierd knot in the rope to clip into the pieces of pro which never seems to work out first time so you gotta tie it again and again. Or maybe just getting behind a big rock for the hip belay?

 

My question is, if the cordellete is not simple enough, then what do you guys use to make an anchor? and is it really easier and faster than a cordellete?

 

[high_on_rock]

I use a hip belay quite often on trad routes. Quick, simple, effecient.

[genepires]

a hip belay is not an anchor. a stance for the hip belay is an anchor. are you suggesting that simply having the rope in a hip belay is acceptable for a trad route? why not for a sport route?

[Pencil_Pusher]

Hip belay was just a reference to old school ways. I don't think it was intended to compare with cordalettes or the like in terms of an anchor. It was a reaction to this thread topic versus the post preceding it (I think).

[high_on_rock]

Sitting my butt behind a BFR and throwing on a hip belay is both an anchor and a belay. I quess I have also used a hip belay on Sport routes also; top of Whereever I shall Roam at Smith; Monkey face (not the aid pitch).

[ken4ord]

My question is, if the cordellete is not simple enough, then what do you guys use to make an anchor? and is it really easier and faster than a cordellete?

 

 

I would like to know the answer to this question too, hell if I can make things simpler trad and alpine climbing, please let me know.

 

 

 

Also sliding X is not the same as a properly rigged cordelette, you still end up shock loading the remaining pieces if any pieces blow, though the friction in the twist does reduce the load slightly.

 

 

[goatboy]

Another way of asking this question:

 

How many people who are currently making the cordelette their standard default anchor are familiar and competent using slings and/or the rope itself as anchor points, but are CHOOSING to use the cordellette because they think it's quicker and more effective?

 

And, flip-side, how many people who are currently using the slings and/or rope as their default anchor are familiar and competent using the cordellette, but instead CHOOSE to use the slings/rope because they think it's quicker and more effective?

 

My sense of this conversation, so far, is that the sling-advocated continue to do so because they have not learned different means. The slings have always worked for them, so they continue to use them....

 

I believe that the cordellette is in fact simpler and faster and would like to ask if there are people who are comfortable and familiar with its simple use who dis-agree?

[high_on_rock]

When you are attached to 200 feet of rope, why do you need a cordelette? You have slings, draws, and rope already, why pack more.

[ken4ord]

Well if you don't mind cutting your rope down for bailing or throwing around a big block for an anchor, then I guess you got a good point.

 

Now that I have been carrying cordelettes on my rack, I dont bring as many slings (10-12 slings and draws total).

 

Again someone please explain a way of building a solid and truely equalized anchor, that is faster than clipping each piece, pulling a loop down inbetween each piece and tie. With slings and draws I was always girth hitching slings together, then doing sliding X or X's depending on how far the pieces were apart. I have found that sometimes I even prefer my cordelette for bolted anchors, I double up the the cordelette, girth hitch to one bolt, clip the other, pull and tie. You have an equalized anchor only using one carabiner and cordelette.