Flipper Pie

[archenemy]

Hell, I could go for some white wine right now!!!

[Dechristo]

red mammal meat, minx, red mammal meat

[archenemy]

Details.

[archenemy]

and

deflippers

[Dechristo]

seal de leon

[G-spotter]

I remember a few years back when some tribe in the northwest was going to harvest a few whales. They insisted they had the right to do so, because it was their tradition and their way of life, etc.

 

I remember being surprised that speedboats and explosive harpoons were (apparently) also part of their native american whaling heritage.

 

Go figure.

 

No shit! I have this problem with native hunting special rights as well. In Montana, Idaho, and Washington (probably other states as well, but these are the only ones I have read regs for) they are allowed to hunt when and where other people aren't, and they are allowed to use their 4 wheelers and snowmobiles in areas where everyone else is not allow. This is nostalgia? Come on.

 

Tradition is independent of technology. Hunting with a gun instead of a bow is like sending email instead of a letter.

 

Native hunting rights are a privilege, true, but that's what you get for being here first.

 

That said, a right to hunt whales doesn't mean you have to hunt whales. Especially when the whale meat is so full of bioaccumulated PCBs that it qualifies as toxic waste.

[archenemy]

I remember a few years back when some tribe in the northwest was going to harvest a few whales. They insisted they had the right to do so, because it was their tradition and their way of life, etc.

 

I remember being surprised that speedboats and explosive harpoons were (apparently) also part of their native american whaling heritage.

 

Go figure.

 

No shit! I have this problem with native hunting special rights as well. In Montana, Idaho, and Washington (probably other states as well, but these are the only ones I have read regs for) they are allowed to hunt when and where other people aren't, and they are allowed to use their 4 wheelers and snowmobiles in areas where everyone else is not allow. This is nostalgia? Come on.

 

Tradition is independent of technology. Hunting with a gun instead of a bow is like sending email instead of a letter.

 

Native hunting rights are a privilege, true, but that's what you get for being here first.

 

That said, a right to hunt whales doesn't mean you have to hunt whales. Especially when the whale meat is so full of bioaccumulated PCBs that it qualifies as toxic waste.

Tradition is not independent of technology.

 

It is tradition in my family to knit. I knit. I do not use a knitting machine to knit, I use the needles my grandmother gave me. That is the tradition.

 

[G-spotter]

That's not a tradition, that's a specific skill. Hunting a deer with a gun uses different skills than hunting with a bow, but both can maintain a tradition of hunting.

[Weekend_Climberz]

What do Walrus's and Tupperware have in common?

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They both like tight seals

 

bum dum bum ching

[tvashtarkatena]

I believe that the Inuit should have the right to club baby seals, but that they should earn that right by first clubbing a baby polar bear.

[archenemy]

That's not a tradition, that's a specific skill. Hunting a deer with a gun uses different skills than hunting with a bow, but both can maintain a tradition of hunting.

I'm just not following, sometimes I am exceptionally slow.

 

Hunting as a tradtional way of life for subsistance living brings to mind things like hunting with a bow or a spear or whatever was passed down to you in the tradtion of your elders.

 

Hunting, per se, cannot be passed down as a tradition (one which gets special rights and designations) because WE ALL hunted at some point in our ancestors' history.

[archenemy]

Furthermore, tradition often is thought of as oral history passed down through generations. Even the ability to listen, remember, and tell these stories is a skill. So how can something be ruled out as a tradition just because it is also considered a skill?

[G-spotter]

You are confusing traditions and skills. A tradition is an activity. A skill is one way of doing that activity.

 

If you have a tradition of eating pumpkin pie at Thanksgiving, whether you make the pie the same way every year, or whether you update the recipe based on some pumpkin pie you enjoyed at a friend's house, or whether you eat a store bought pie one year, you still maintain the tradition of pumpkin pie eating.

 

Same like if you have a tradition of hunting whales then what tools you use to carry out the activity do not matter, whether it's a harpoon or an anti-tank rifle. Or if you use a paddled canoe vs. a motorboat.

[Off_White]

Arch, the deal for the natives, at least the local ones that I'm familiar with, is that it is a treaty right, a legal agreement between a tribe and the federal government. The "special right" is something they got in exchange for losing their land, a guarantee of maintaining their access to "usual and accustomed" resources. Arguing that they should be restricted to traditional means is tantamount to insisting that the second amendment only guarantees you can own a musket.

 

 

[archenemy]

Arch, the deal for the natives, at least the local ones that I'm familiar with, is that it is a treaty right, a legal agreement between a tribe and the federal government. The "special right" is something they got in exchange for losing their land, a guarantee of maintaining their access to "usual and accustomed" resources. Arguing that they should be restricted to traditional means is tantamount to insisting that the second amendment only guarantees you can own a musket.

 

I never looked at it like that before. Good explaination. Thanks! I love that feeling of, "Oh, I see. I wasn't taking that into consideration" that hits when I hear a viewpoint like this.

[minx]

dammit! i think archie should only be allowed to hunt with a musket.

[G-spotter]

A delightful aromatic musket.

[archenemy]

I fart in your general direction.