Recommendations on Bivy Sacks?

[SherpaJim]

Folks:

I'm finding more times when I would rather bivy than take a tent (I'm referring to alpine climbs, not rock). Any recommendations on Bivies? OR seems to have the greatest variation in models and features, but I've looked at Integral Designs,Bibler/BD, Moonstone, TNF, MH, and some generic brands like MEC.

I'm not planning on using it in warmer weather (so bug netting isn't a priority with me) but it's got to withstand all forms of

prolonged percipitation. And, of course, weight is a factor.

- Jim

[admin]

I've had an OR Advanced bivy for about 2 seasons now and it has treated me well. The feature that I like most about the OR sack is the two pole system that allows you to adjust the portion of the bivy which is over your head to various positions. This is great for those (like me) who sometimes get a little clostrophobic in a bivy, and it gives you more room to move, store gear, and wait out storms.

The advanced *does* have a mosquito net, which adds extra weight, but is extremely handy when the bugs are out. I've often crawled into the bivy to escape bugs.

I spend two nights in the Hoh Rain forest in my OR bivy, and stayed completly dry in a very wet environment. So I think this one won't let you down there.

The major drawback is the weight, but you can always leave the poles at home!

[forrest_m]

I have to disagree with the previous recommendation. Here's my take: you want the bivy for one of two reasons: a) lighter weight or b) you're using it in places where you can't find space to set up a tent (i.e. alpine climbs). However, for a) unless you're by yourself, it's going to be lighter/same weight to go with a lightweight tent split between you and your partner. There are many tents out there that weigh in at just over 4 lbs (single wall tents like the bibler and also lightweight "3-season" tents"). Since most bivy sacks (even the light ones) aren't much less than 2 lbs, for two people, it's the same weight and far more comfortable and weatherproof to have a real tent. In the case of b), if you're actually climbing with the thing, you want the absolutely lightest sack you can find with a minimum of bells, whistles, poles, zippers, etc.

I've used the bibler a lot - if you pull the useless carbon fiber stay out of it, it's pretty close to perfect. The waterproof tie-in point and factory seam taping eliminate the worst sources of water penetration. I don't trust elaborate designs - you don't have the tension that makes that kind of thing reliable in a tent. For a sack that works well sitting up/squeezed onto a shitty ledge, the envelope design is definately the most versatile and reliable.

[SherpaJim]

Thanks for the comments. I'm still on the fence about bivies; not their utility, but rather whether I really need one.

Forrest, I agree with you a 100%. It comes down to the two reasons you cited on why you might choose a bivy over a tent. If getting pinned down in weather is ever an issue, I'll take a tent any day.

I've also experienced the KISS approach to gear. The less bells & whistles the better. If I get a bivy, I'll select one based on simplicity of design, reputation on durability, and weight. Not necessarily in that order!

Thanks..

- Jim

[Guest]

I rarely use bivy sacks. I find that since I have a dryloft coating on my sleeping bag to block wind, all I need is a tarp to keep off the bad weather. I am a lot more comfortable in the rain under a tarp than in a bivy sack.

I use my 7oz 5x7ft personal tarp ($45? Jim's store 'Pro Mountain Sports in the U dist) for nice to moderate weather. I use my 17oz 8x10ft tarp ($2 @ gear-grab)for two in moderate weather, or just me in any weather.

I have never had a problem finding something to tie the tarp to. There always seems to be a bush, tree, rock, ice axe, or ski pole to set it all up with.

But if you go with a bivy sack, buy one that is at least 2/3 hairy gortex (nexus, todd tech, . . .) or you might as well have brought a realy big plastic bag. btw, lawn leaf bags work great for emergencies.

[Steve]

I've got a Bibler tripod. Works great. About 2 1/2 pounds.

I checked into the ORs and thought the design was poor.

The Bibler is rather costly, though, about $300.

[dbconlin]

Whatever you do, stay away from the Garuda designs bivy sold through dana designs. I know numerous friends that got a pro-deal on these and had nothing but bad things to say and very wet sleeping bags.

I have an REI bivy, which I like (only 1 lb., neat hood/armhole design so you can cook in it), but its not perfect (i.e. wet in extended damp conditions, claustrophobic at times). Also, it's cheap ($150), but I'm not sure they make it anymore.

[mikeadam]

Several things:

Hooped is good IMHO. Ever woke up in a bivvy with 2 feet of snow on your face? It's freaky and the hoop is not really that big of a deal weight wise. Secondly hooped is good if you have broad shoulders. You can move around a bit without killing yourself, place items near your head such as a headlamp, etc.

Tents are great, but hey, then you have to put your sleeping bag in a stuff sack. More weight, more work. Just stuff your bag in your bivvy, zip it and go. When you stop pull it out, crawl in.

I have a Bibler hooped and it is the standard for all adventures. Doesn't have any straps to hold your sleeping pad. It is very waterproof and durable. 8 out of 10 stars. Was fairly well priced. Around $200 if I remember right. There is also a big wall version for tying in.

I also have an OR basic (or whatever it's called-works fine, but lays on my face) Has hoops to secure your sleeping pad. Never had it in bad weather so can't comment on it's durablity and weather worthiness.

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[Guest]

I have a Wild Things sack that works O.K., but it has a weird cross chest zipper and no pole. As a "back sleeper," it sits on my face all night if I have to keep it zipped up. Wouldn't recommend this one.

Bought an Integral Designs "Endurance" sack from Jim Nelson this spring. Only used it twice this summer, but it is so light and packs so small that you could take it even if only for emergencies, or with full intention to use it as I did. It breathes adequately, though some condensation built by morning, and doesn't sit on my face like the Wild Things model. Even if zipped up, I can push it up off my face, and it sort of hovers there, perhaps afraid to get too near my morning breath.

No matter what, before you buy: Go see Jim Nelson at Pro Mountain Sports. I say this as his friend, his lawyer, and as someone who believes that he knows more about gear than anyone else in town.

Good luck.

John Sharp

Bellevue

[dbb]

OR makes a good bivi that they call their "winter sack". Made of dryloft it is super light and breathable, though not totally waterproof. But hey, if it's raining or snowing that hard, you're going to get wet anyways.

I agree though with tent idea. A friend and I have been using his Marmot single wall for most iffy weather situations this summer and it was a heck of a lot warmer than the old cramped bivi sack. If you're wondering where to put your money (which will probably be a lot of it), get a nice single wall tent (~4 lbs w/o vestibule) and make yourself a superlight sack our of dryloft or coated nylon for those sunny summer climbs.

Dave

[Mike_Palmer]

The Bibler is the lightest hooped Bivy on the market at 22ozs. The OR bivys are a nice design and may handle a bit more weather, but at 26oz and 32 oz, you might as well take a two person tent and split the load between two people. Once you start bivvying you never go back to a tent. It is the only way to go.

Mike

Cascade Crags

[dbb]

never go back until you get totally soaked and then freeze because your sitting in a little sack instead of a heat-keeping tent!

[mikeadam]

DBB,

Time to start walking home...

Mike

[littleworker]

Hello is the bibler bivy sacks free standing or are they stakes required

[littleworker]

Hey

Is the OR ADV. Bivi free standing or is it stakes required

[Plinko]

the OR Advanced bivy is freestanding. Although the OR bivvys are pretty bomber, they're a pain in the ass to get in and out of, and they're on the heavy side of things. Hooped (or some sort of wire stiffener) is totally the way to go...something that will keep the fabric off your face...like the Bibler Tripod or Hooped Bivy...TNF even makes one that's easy to get in and out of, but you have to deal with assembling poles (PITA). Integral Designs is my fav, especially their eVent fabric bivys...South Col, Bugaboo, Unishelter and more... The "generic" MEC bivys are made by Interal Designs so you might be able to score a better deal there. Lots to choose from...good luck.

[IceIceBaby]

I got the eVENT South Col frigging love this thing

[JoshK]

It seems like a bivy made out of a not fully waterproof material would be pretty bad if you actually started getting rained or wet snowed on, tho?

[cracked]

eVENT is waterproof. You thinking of the endurance sac?

[Dru]

he was thinking about epic?

[ryland_moore]

I have the Bibler Big Wall and I think it sucks. The opening is way too small (and I am 5'8" 155lbs.) and the zippers are small and bust off easily. I'd go with a wider oepning to get into an emergency shelter/lightweight. If I was in an emergency and needed to get into the thing quickly, I'd probably shred it before even getting in the thing.

[JoshK]

Yup, sorry, thinking about epic...too many damn fabrics...

[Joey]

OK, If anyone decides to get an OR Advanced BV, check my thread out over in the yard sale forum...I'm planning to get rid of a brand new one ASAP

[Stephen_Ramsey]

I'm just a gaper, but I still don't see the point of a bivy sack. My partner and I can share our I-Tent (4 lbs) or Firstlight (2.5 lbs) for less weight per person than using hooped bivy sacks. And we get the benefit of shared heat, better ventilation, and the ability to actually do something like study the map or eat or sort the rack, while sitting out the weather. For situations where weight is REALLY an issue, we can leave the poles behind and use the tent as a bivy sack for two, and it is definitely less weight than two minimal bivy sacks. Maybe for the dreaded 24" rock ledge bivy, sacks would be better, but in the PNW isn't that sort of like being inconvenienced 99% of the time for the 1% corner case? Am I missing something great about these magical bivy sacks?

Edited June 18, 2004 by Stephen_Ramsey

[cracked]

Yeah, a bibler would be nice. But I refuse to spend 600 dollars on a tent that's too small for me. Besides, my bivy weighs just over a pound. And packs down to a liter.