XXX Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Just curious. If the weather broke wouldn't they head up to the summit and down the south side? For those who climb Hood often would it be easier to summit and go down the south side or to climb down the North face from where they found the snow cave? Looks to me like the South side is the easy side to get down. Again let me state I have not climbed Hood so I am just curious. With all the developments lets stay positive. The guys need our prayers and positive vibes. Here is east coast sending our prayers. Wayne New Jersey They did summit, and I believe their cave is on the south side. Either way If they are ok they should be trying to get down today on their own power. That is what I would do today if I was in that situation.
gslater Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Just curious. If the weather broke wouldn't they head up to the summit and down the south side? For those who climb Hood often would it be easier to summit and go down the south side or to climb down the North face from where they found the snow cave? Looks to me like the South side is the easy side to get down. Again let me state I have not climbed Hood so I am just curious. With all the developments lets stay positive. The guys need our prayers and positive vibes. Here is east coast sending our prayers. Wayne New Jersey South side would indeed be easier to descend after topping out, but remember, these guys had never been on Hood before, so that would be facing the devil they don't know, as opposed to the one that they do.
Zeta Male Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Apparently (http://www.oregonlive.com/newslogs/oregonian/) the sheriff is specifying "ice axes"; since, unfortunately, they have to deal with stuff like this all too often, I bet he knows what he's talking about. I'll take that bet if this is the same sheriff that waited til two days ago to give the Ranger station note to the rescue crews. Yeah, I was wondering about that too, why it took so long to release that information - I wonder what the deal was with that?
SWNick Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 "They keep saying that the "Y" is meant and 'yes, I am here'. That's not what I think it meant. Wouldn't that be an arrow pointing out that they left and which direction they may have gone?" Agreed. I've never heard of this being some sort of universal climber's code. Anyone confirm or deny?
Lambone Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 with the avy conditions it would have been safer to continue up then descend the North Face. Either of those gullies would be death traps with all the fresh snow. they'd know that.
lizs Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Still wishing everyone best of luck. One comment. They keep saying that the "Y" is meant and 'yes, I am here'. That's not what I think it meant. Wouldn't that be an arrow pointing out that they left and which direction they may have gone? I wondered that also. At some point earlier today, that was mentioned, that something like that could be an arrow. Also, when thinking of the media -- doing a live newscast for almost 3 hours now -- try to think of having to sit down yourself and, say, talk about advanced math with professors for three hours? They don't get it all right, but are doing a pretty decent job.
Big_Mac Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 The Only reason to leave an Ice Axe is that 1 person was incapacitated so it would be of no use. These guys would not leave such a vital peice of safety gear like an Axe. (self arrest tool for the non-hikers who are watching) He He just kidding fellow "hikers"
LHwildcats76 Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 I asked the same question. No response. I guess no one who has been up there is reading this board. They're all involved in the rescue.
SWNick Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Understandable that they might try to relocate if the orig cave was in avy path in one the NF gullies.
Lambone Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Big Mac, they each had two tools I'm sure. The north Face is a technical climb requiring two tools. My guess is the two guys who went out for help just took one sleeping bag and one tool each. Leaving the third man behind with an extra sleeping bag and their extra tools. Eventually the third guy decided to move, probly bacause he was frezzing to death sitting still for so long. he left the extra sleeping bag and tools behind and went up. just my guess.
LHwildcats76 Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 They did summit, and I believe their cave is on the south side. Either way If they are ok they should be trying to get down today on their own power. That is what I would do today if I was in that situation. Why do you think the cave that was found is on the south side?
techboy Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 South Side is not as gnarly...but it is too easy for the uninformed to follow the fall line into Zig Zag Canyon. I wonder how recent those footprints were? If they were from today or yesterday, wouldn't the person who made them have been visible given the search efforts?
Zeta Male Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Still wishing everyone best of luck. One comment. They keep saying that the "Y" is meant and 'yes, I am here'. That's not what I think it meant. Wouldn't that be an arrow pointing out that they left and which direction they may have gone? I wondered that also. At some point earlier today, that was mentioned, that something like that could be an arrow. That was me, but I'm glad the issue's being talked about more thoroughly now - maybe these remarks will be seen by somebody in a position to consider additional possibilities beyond what's been assumed up to now - not that they aren't already - and make good use of them.
Lambone Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Why do you think the cave that was found is on the south side? He means the cave they are in now, not the one they found.
SWNick Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 I'm troubled by tools left behind. How steep is NF? I'd want two tools on anything more than 50 degrees. Also, rope found there suggests a solo climber.
Dallashopefull Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 guys, listen... they probly each had two tools for the steep NF Gully. Once past the gully they wouldn't need two tools anymore. we can't realy draw any meaningfull conclusions from the abandoned gear. all we know is they are still out there somewhere...hopefully dug in and hanging in there... A fine, useful technical/equipment point. That would mean they went up and over instead of retracing their steps right?
LHwildcats76 Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Eventually the third guy decided to move, probly bacause he was frezzing to death sitting still for so long. That theory would fly in the face of every other theory that says it's warmer and safer in your cave then venturing out in the cold.
Lambone Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 they wouldn't retrace their steps. not without a rope anyway. they gully would require many rappels.
Big_Mac Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Coverage is going stupid at this time, reported by folks that think roughing it is Howard Johnson's
knelson Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Standard air to ground signal is "Y" for yes. An arrow indicating direction of travel is, well... an arrow " -> " Guess what's more important is what it meant for the folks that left the signal! Prayers to all involved.
SWNick Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Eventually the third guy decided to move, probly bacause he was frezzing to death sitting still for so long. That theory would fly in the face of every other theory that says it's warmer and safer in your cave then venturing out in the cold. Are there any known cases of people leaving their cave to be found elsewhere, without an accident, and without digging a new cave? more likely he (James, most likely) was out of fuel (needed to melt snow for water)and knew he had to make a dash for it, maybe during slight weather window before weekend
Lambone Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Eventually the third guy decided to move, probly bacause he was frezzing to death sitting still for so long. That theory would fly in the face of every other theory that says it's warmer and safer in your cave then venturing out in the cold. Are there any known cases of people leaving their cave to be found elsewhere, without an accident, and without digging a new cave? have you ever sat in a wet tent or a snowcave in freezing conditions for several days in a row? One body isn't enough warmth to keep a snowcave very warm, three maybe, but not just one. at some point it's either get moving and get your core temp up, or die in your sleep from hypothermia.
Macson Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 I didn't see in the "inventory" of what they found in the cave anything about shovels. If I was carrying an axe and a couple tools I could definitely see leaving the tools in favor of an axe and shovel. Presumably they (or he) still have a shovel so another cave could be built. Also, if they found rope in the cave, and rope outside as a signal it makes me wonder if they're all together. I mean, if 2 left they would have taken a rope with them, and I'd be surprised if they had more than 2 ropes.
Zeta Male Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 Big Mac, they each had two tools I'm sure. The north Face is a technical climb requiring two tools. My guess is the two guys who went out for help just took one sleeping bag and one tool each. Leaving the third man behind with an extra sleeping bag and their extra tools. Eventually the third guy decided to move, probly bacause he was frezzing to death sitting still for so long. he left the extra sleeping bag and tools behind and went up. just my guess. Similar to what I'm thinking; you've worked out the details.
east coast hiker Posted December 17, 2006 Posted December 17, 2006 With all I have read over the last couple of days on this forum, from the expert climbers, These guys were top notch and knew what they were doing. In their notes they stated their escape route was the South side. In putting all this together they summited and are on the south side. Remember with all the climbs these guys have made they have the expertise to survive hood. We will see them alive to hear there stories and know exactly what transpired. Keep the faith and continue to pray.
Recommended Posts