Blake Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 Some fellows at the SMoke bluffs today broke a BD hotwire carabiner on a very short fall. Probably no more than a 7 foot fall, with probably 30 feet of rope out. The biner broke at the top of the spine where it begins to bend. It was definitely not a "new biner" but looked like the ones on my (and most likely your) rack. His next piece down caught him and he was ok.. but how common is this kinda thing? They weren't able to tell if the gate was open or not at the time of the fall. It didn't appear to be loaded over an edge. -Blake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telemarker Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 He bootied it at the base of El Cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
high_on_rock Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 (edited) Guys, if you have any updated information on this I would love to hear it. Was this a booty biner, thus supporting the argument to never trust gear that someone else left behind? Was this a biner in which he knew the history making it a pure failure? E Edited October 22, 2006 by high_on_rock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 Maybe it was a Neutrino and he found it on Girth Pillar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted October 22, 2006 Author Share Posted October 22, 2006 It was a BD hotwire. Someone asked him if it had been dropped and he or his partner said not that theycould remember, and that dropping gear (even a long ways) doesn't damage it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 what route did they fall on? maybe the biner got stuck against the rock or in a crack or something - and broke like kropp's did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted October 23, 2006 Author Share Posted October 23, 2006 Dru, i'm sure you would know the name of it. I was on Harmfull Health, next to Quarryman in teh SMoke bluffs, and they were about 30 feet to my right... i think it was an .11- trad line. They seemed like squamish locals, one of them had just downclimbed Quarryman before they walked over to do the climb on which the carabiner snapped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 Some fellows at the SMoke bluffs today broke a BD hotwire carabiner on a very short fall. Probably no more than a 7 foot fall, with probably 30 feet of rope out. The biner broke at the top of the spine where it begins to bend. It was definitely not a "new biner" but looked like the ones on my (and most likely your) rack. His next piece down caught him and he was ok.. but how common is this kinda thing? They weren't able to tell if the gate was open or not at the time of the fall. It didn't appear to be loaded over an edge. -Blake [/quote shit happens. cool story for the grandchildren. glad your alive. you get to climb another day. peace out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jordop Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 Dru, i'm sure you would know the name of it. I was on Harmfull Health, next to Quarryman in teh SMoke bluffs, and they were about 30 feet to my right... i think it was an .11- trad line. They seemed like squamish locals, one of them had just downclimbed Quarryman before they walked over to do the climb on which the carabiner snapped. Health Hazard? 10a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 does it matter what route it's on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmknight Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 If someone doesnt think dropping biners is bad for their structural integrity then maybe they deserve the excitement of an occasional break. I love booty, but carabiners are too critical to not know the history of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 I marvel at those that believe a biner dropped from a great height onto stone doesn't possibly affect its integrity. I found a sling and some biners on the south apron below Wolf's Head in the Wind River Cirque, presumably dropped from high above. The sling I used climbing, the biners were relegated to putting camera, water bottle, etc., on belay on the pack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fern Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 Read Accidents in North American Mountaineering to get an idea of carabiner breakage rates. It is actually fairly common - probably the most common reported mode of actual gear failure rather than operator failure - though often operator error sets up the circumstance for gear failure (eg clove hitching to intermediate pieces when rope soloing). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snoboy Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 I marvel at those that believe a biner dropped from a great height onto stone doesn't possibly affect its integrity. I found a sling and some biners on the south apron below Wolf's Head in the Wind River Cirque, presumably dropped from high above. The sling I used climbing, the biners were relegated to putting camera, water bottle, etc., on belay on the pack. OK - this bothers me... I can imagine the sling getting cut when it was landed on by the biners. Not only that, fabric and cordage is vunerable to things that can't be seen like acid damage etc. I believe I have read about testing by BD of a bunch of booty biners (including ones that had been dropped) and the ones that passsed visual inspection tested out as good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catbirdseat Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 Read Accidents in North American Mountaineering to get an idea of carabiner breakage rates. It is actually fairly common - probably the most common reported mode of actual gear failure rather than operator failure - though often operator error sets up the circumstance for gear failure (eg clove hitching to intermediate pieces when rope soloing). Why would someone do this? That doesn't strike me as a wise thing to do at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 Catbird, are you asking why would somebody clove hitch intermediate pieces? Simple: they want to limit the distance they are likely to fall. Yes, it will place greater strain on the gear and possibly on the climber's spine, but the greatest danger in many situations arises from the possiblity of hitting something during your fall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catbirdseat Posted October 23, 2006 Share Posted October 23, 2006 I can understand the motivation, but not the wisdom of it. If you did this, any fall would be a FF 2 fall on a single piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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