knelson Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Are you mocking me again? Ask yourself, "why do I feel the need to mock these things" many times. Oh. Or is it "why do I feel the need to mock these things? why do I feel the need to mock these things? why do I feel the need to mock these things? why do I feel the need to mock these things?" Damn. I can't figure out which one it is. I really want to do this right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 To cage a mocking bird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirp Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 That is a beauty. It reminds me of a huge cala lily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemoreJugs Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 well done knelson. I bow to your wit, which overwhealms me with cynicism, hate, and self-destruction. Have fun storming the castle! Drum roll please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 I think I've seen you. Don't you wear mock turtlenecks all the time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirp Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 As a general rule, Erowid neither recommends nor discourages the use of any psychoactive, however, in the case of tropane alkaloid-containing Solanaceae plants, we think it is important to note that an overwhelming majority of those who describe to us their use of Datura (and to a lesser extent, Belladonna, Brugmansia and Brunfelsia) find their experiences extremely mentally and physically unpleasant and not infrequently physically dangerous. There is no way to guess a reasonable dose, because potency of the plant material itself and appropriate dose for an individual appear to vary so much. The question of what "reasonable" means for something that so often leads to such ridiculously negative effects is hard to say. As an admixture plant in some traditional ayahuasca brews, smoking blends, or other preparations, parts of these plants are generally used in very low doses. Because of the serious adverse consequences associated with tropane alkaloids (scopolamine, atropine, hyoscyamine) intoxication and the wide variation in doses used, we are unwilling to even speculate about specific dosages for the leaves, flowers, and seeds of these plants. If you are considering ingesting Datura-group plants, please read extensively from the collected experience reports and never take them without a reliable, sober sitter who understands the likely health issues and who can stop you from walking in front of traffic. Please note that fatalities from ingesting Datura do occur and hospitalizations seem to be quite common, in spite of the relatively low rates of psychoactive use of these plants. Datura details Ever since I heard of Datura from a friend at school a few years ago, I have always tried to get a hold of some, asking dealers I knew from around town. But I was never successful, as many people I asked didn't even know what it was. So after awhile I gave up hope and continued with the usual, smoking grass everyday, occasionally scoring some ketamine or opium to make life a little more interesting. Then last year I finally got a chance to try the stuff. One of my friends told me he had gone to stay with his grandparents for a week and noticed a plant near their house that looked a lot like Datura, so he went over to it and sure enough he saw the small, spikey pods growing near the bottom of the plant. He himself didn’t want to try any because he always feared any sort of hallucinogen because of the risk of a bad trip, but knew I had been wanting to try it for quite some time, so he picked one of the magical pods and wrapped it up in cellophane and brought them back for me. The bastard wouldn’t hand them over unless I paid him 20 bucks, but I figured it would be well worth it. I couldn’t wait to try them. First thing I did was found someone who would be a sitter for me, and that sitter was the most trustworthy friend I know (lets call him Steve). I asked my mom if he could sleep over and she said it was fine. So the next day, Steve came over around noon, and I got the seeds out of the pod and counted 37. I heard it only took like 10 or 15, and I wanted to have more so I could trip another time or sell them, so I decided to take 15. T:00.00 - Me and Steve went up to my room to take them. We put on some music and sat down in my bean bag chairs. I was feeling confident that things were going to go smoothly, mostly just because Steve was there with me, he was a very responsible person who I felt very safe and secure with. Of course I had a little butterflies in my stomach because I was taking something new, but it was mostly excitement, a total 'I can’t wait' feeling. As Steve and I talked, I decided it was time, and pulled the sandwich baggie out of my pocket. I got all the seeds in my palm and looked at them, little teardrop shaped things, darkish brown, almost black. I thought to my self 'here goes nothing' and licked my palm to get all the seeds stuck on my tongue, chewed ‘em up a bit, and swallowed. As they went down I got this overwhelming feeling of 'finally'. I have finally taken this crazy Datura, and in time I will be experiencing it. All I could do now is relax, keep the best state of mind I possibly could, and wait for things to kick in. T:00.30 - Went down to the kitchen with Steve to get a drink of water, and then went to the bathroom. No noticeable effects. Steve suggested we play video games while we wait for it to kick in. We went back to my room and played Mario Kart 64 and snacked on some doritos. T:00.50 - Starting to feel different. A lot like when you need to stretch really bad, but in my whole body. Mouth is getting dry, very similar to the cottonmouth after smoking a thick blunt. Steve is winning the game and I am loosing my grip on the controller, and I can’t seem to keep the A button pushed down. After about 10 minutes I feel much different, very intense, and I’m wondering why Steve is in my room playing video games. He reminds me that he is sleeping over to watch me because I took Datura. Right after he says this a wave of shock and fear run down my body like goosebumps, for I had completely forgotten the reason he was there, and that I had taken anything, although I do recall it, I am needless to say in shock at what just happened with my brain. I look at Steve and say 'calm me down', and somehow, Steve knew exactly what to do. He just smiled at me in this reassuring smile and said 'don’t worry man, you’re gonna have a blast' this made me feel incredibly better, and my mood shifted. After this, things seem to go back to normal, and I ask Steve to stop playing video games and go downstairs with me. We go downstairs into my kitchen and I pull a full pitcher of cherry kool-aid from the fridge. Steve got 2 glasses, then we went into my living room and sat down on the couch. I pour the both of us a glass and we sip it while watching tv. Afer I finish my glass I pick up the pitcher and gulp it down halfway. I am very thirsty, but the drink doesn’t seem to quench my thirst at all, it seems to glide over the surface of my mouth, leaving it dry still. I now just try my best to ignore it, and continue watching tv. T:01:30 I tell Steve I’ll be right back, and walk to the bathroom. While I piss I look at this picture above my toilet. It’s a cartoon of a polar bear lying on its back in the water, holding a wine glass like it fell asleep from being drunk. The concept makes me want to laugh, it seems like the dumbest cartoon in the world to me, and its location is just as random as its contents. I think to my self 'why the f*** do we have a picture of a drunk polar bear in our bathroom'. For some reason, this seems near hysterical to me. I walk out of the bathroom and go back to the couch with Steve. As soon as I sit down, my mom walked out of the kitchen and tells us she’s going to work and to behave, she’ll be back around 10. Steve and I say good bye and she leaves. Perfect. Now we have the house to ourselves. T:02:00 - Nothing much more seems to be happening. I have finished the pitcher of kool-aid and gone to the bathroom 2 more times. Steve says to go in the kitchen and refill the pitcher with water in case I feel like I’m going to dehydrate. It seems like a responsible idea so I go into the kitchen and refill it with water and put ice cubes in it. I walk back into my living room to find Steve has left, and the tv has been turned off. The entire house is dead silent. Then I hear the tv go back on, but the screen is blank, and I hear Steve saying 'hey I’m over here'. I realize that he’s calling me from out in my backyard, so I put my shoes on and go outside. At first I scanned my back yard for him, but couldn’t see him, and I couldn’t hear him anymore. I suddenly get the idea that Steve had come over for a hide and seek game (at this point I have absolutely no idea that I have taken anything) so I run into the yard looking around for him. Then I speak 'come out come out where ever you are' . Right when I say this my voice sounds very different, like a person who has gone totally insane. This starts to scare me very much, and Steve is nowhere to be found. I look way across to the other end of my yard (my yard is only about a 100 foot by 200 foot area, but now it was a soccer field size) and at the other end I see my dog’s pen, a fenced in area in the corner with all my friends who are straight edge that stopped being friends with me when I started smoking pot. I haven’t seen them in so long, so I run towards the pen. They look just as happy to see me as I am to see them, and they let me into the pen. We start talking and to my surprise, one of them pulls a blunt out of nowhere and sparks it. I am naturally amused but shocked, then they start to explain to me that they came to see me cause they all 'got into the game' and don’t think drugs are that bad after all. On the outside I am pleased to hear this, but on the inside I begin to get feelings of untrust. These bastards abandoned me years back. I don’t show any unpleasant feelings on the outside, and I continue to be cheery with them, although I keep a state of mind not to trust anyone there. They pass me the blunt and I take a super long hit, and hold it super long and blow out. After it went around a few times we all spark a cigarette to increase our high. We just keep talking and talking. It seems like time has stopped. How long can people just sit here and talk? It’s been hours, I think to myself (strangely enough I am still puffing on the same cigarette, but dont notice anything unusual about it). Then I drop my butt, and it falls under the chair I’m sitting on. 'Ah Shit' I said and got out of my seat to get it. I look under the chair but I can’t seem to find it. 'Did any of you see were my...' as I turn around I notice no one is there, and I am alone in the pen. A sense of anger comes over me, and I get intense feelings of 'I shouldnt have trusted them' and 'how dare they'. These feelings are followed by loneliness and then total fear. I need to get out of this pen and go back in the house. I walk back to my house across the long field, and it seems to take even longer to go back than when I had come. Next thing I know I’m back in my kitchen lying on the floor very sweaty, Steve is there sitting on the kitchen counter. My focus is very blurred and 'off' and I feel very confused about why he’s there on the counter and I’m on the floor, but every few moments I kinda snap back into reality and know exactly what going on, then snap back into delirium and totally forget everything. Next thing I know its already 6:46am and I am running late. My mom tells me I only got a half hour to get ready or ill get a Saturday detention. I scramble out of bed and run into the bathroom to take a shower. I suddenly realize how mush school’s gonna suck cause I forgot to do my homework and I have an oral presentation due today. All these thoughts make me panic and I know there’s no way out of it cause I already skipped school 3 times this year and got caught and I cant skip another day or I have to go to court. I get out of the shower and dry off as quickly as I can. Then I run into my room and get dressed and go downstairs to the kitchen. Right then I noticed something was wrong, the clock said 1:00am and the calendar was on July. No body was up. My mom was asleep and had been asleep. She didn’t wake me up for school, I did not have school in summer. I wished I was dreaming, and the thoughts in my mind were on the brink of driving me insane. All I remember after this is running back up into my room in total panic ready to cry and scream and if one more weird thing happened I was gonna commit suicide. I woke up in my bed with Steve on the floor watching me, he looked very concerned and asked me if I was ok now, if I was still tripping. I didn’t know what to say to him, cause right then I could have still be tripping for all I know. It was 5:00pm the next day, I had a bad headache and couldn’t focus on shit, and my whole body was in this dreadfully uncomfortable state. It took me awhile to collect my thoughts and figure out I was not tripping anymore, and I had these series of very strange realistic dreams stuck in my head from when I was asleep, but I can’t for the life of me remember what they were now, I forgot them completely about 4 hours after I woke up. From Steve’s point of view, in a nutshell, I had started acting weird when I had gotten the water from the kitchen. He said that he was trying to talk to me but I would just have this blank stare like I couldn’t see him, and then ran outside into my shed in the backyard and started talking to myself, and after an hour or so I ran out of the shed with this scared shitless look on my face and fell down, and crawled back into the house, into the bathroom and he said I was trying to drink out of the toilet, he pulled me up and carried me into the kitchen and put down on the floor and got some ice for me. He said I was talking in my sleep and saying random words in no logical order whatsoever but I was saying them fluently like I knew what I was talking about. Before my mom came home, he carried me upstairs and put me to bed, and stayed up to watch me, and he said I was talking out loud and moving around like I was having nightmares, and around midnight I sprang out of bed and ran into the bathroom and got in the shower for an hour and then went back into my room and put a shirt on backwards and some boxers but no pants and ran downstairs and stood in the kitchen for 10 minutes, just standing there. He said then I freaked out and ran upstairs into my room and he said he had to push me onto my bed and hold me down until I stopped moving, and eventually fell asleep, then he did. He woke up around 10 that day and I slept till 5. To sum it up in one word...insanity. That’s what if feels like if you start to snap out of it and realize what’s happening, but then you just go back into this state of total confusion and its enough to drive anyone crazy. Overall I am glad I experienced this, just to know what its like, but this is not for everyone, and I’m not saying the experience was at all pleasant, so I have no motivation to do it again anytime soon, maybe someday years from now just for some crazy fun. But this Datura seems to be something not of this world. The hallucinations were accompanied by delirium and confusion which made them seem real and like I wasn’t really tripping. This stuff truly is THE DEVIL’S WEED. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 thanks. I'll tuck that info away for save keeping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemoreJugs Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Sounds like a mix between good weed and mescaline. Have you read any Carlos Casteneda. What really struck me was the entire epidose with his friends and how the yard's scale expanded dramatically. Its funny. To this day, I still have recurrent dream themes about high school friends that alienated me. As much as my conscious, rational mind tells me that I am over this, obviously, I am still not entirely. The funny thing is, our 10 year reunion is coming up this fall. I really thought it would be a waste of time to go, but now, I am thinking maybe I should go to confront these issues. that way, I can have more dreams about climbing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archenemy Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Confronting issues is different from confronting people. I have noticed that when I do not do the former, I usually make a mess of the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knelson Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 Semore - OK... you made me feel guilty for spraying a can of smartass all over your serious post, so here's an honest response to your quest. In my opinion, no one is going to find any form of enlightenment until they let go of their own expectations they thrust upon others. My take of your internet persona here is that you're someone who gets bent out of shape when others don't perform to YOUR expectations. I'm a recovering anal-retentative control freak myself. (Have a kid - you'll let go of the control freak thing right fast if you know what's good for you.) I just about blew beer through my nostrils when I read your Emmons trip report in which you reported that you went to your rope mate and "demanded" to know why he fell! Ack... fun time had by all there! You seem to have a definite way in which you want things done - hence my smartass response to the "why do I mock" statement. In mocking your statement, I was trying to draw the "correct" response out of you to help me make my point, but alas... you are strong and resisted! Your trip up the Emmons seems to be a great analogy for why so many people can't feel free or "englightened." They are so busy focusing on the weaknesses of others, or how others aren't doing what they "should" be doing, that they miss the big picture and don't see the silver lining. There's always a silver lining... if you want to see it. I believe Norman_Clyde made a pretty good point on page 1... "Wordly satisfaction is not about being able to get anything you want; it's about wanting the things you can actually have, that are worth having." And while you thought our ambassador from Jellystone Park, Mr. Yogi was mocking you, I believe he was just putting Norman's words in even more clearer terms: "You silly bastards stumble around looking forever in your minds for enlightenment; it's the misplaced eyeglasses that sit on top your heads." Yup... enlightenment is there all the time - you just need to see it. Damn smart bear. Oh... and this really isn't mocking, but I have experienced the whole breathing through the ear thingy. I've found that it signals a sudden drop in the pollen count and my friggin right ear finally opens up from my allergies. I don't feel any more enlightened than usual, but it sure feels good. -kurt PS - And yes Olyclimber... I do sport a few mock turtlenecks during the winter months. PPS - And I've never worn a helmet on the Emmons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemoreJugs Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 knelson. Thanks. Sorry I got a stick up my ass. I guess I was a bit annoyed becuase it seems like anytime someone tries to have one serious conversation, someone has to rain down with the sarcasm and negativity. Dont get me wrong, I love to be a smartass just like anyone else. I guess I just had my panties in a wad that day. You hit upon a nerve I;ve been trying to ferret out. However its a tricky bastard. I reek of control freak. Deep-seeded issues and stuff. You dont want to hear the backstory I'm sure. Your trip up the Emmons seems to be a great analogy for why so many people can't feel free or "englightened." They are so busy focusing on the weaknesses of others, or how others aren't doing what they "should" be doing, that they miss the big picture and don't see the silver lining. There's always a silver lining... if you want to see it. You are very right. And you know, on our way down, I did see that silver lining for an entire day. It was a day of utter honesty with myself. I'm not kidding. It was beautiful and horrible at the same time. It was quite a gift. Its shocking to realize how much we gaurd ourselves from, well, ourselves. SAdly, despite concentrated efforts, I lose sight of this and fall into my control freakish tendencies, especially with strangers that I dont yet trust (ie everyone on this site). You hit the nail on the head. Its a lot easier to try to "fix" or point out someone else's flaws, than it is to focus on one's own and do something about it. Its a bitch, I really am trying, but I slip into these patterns so subtly I often dont realize it until I get a wake-up call such as yours. So thank you. Lets see how long my memory lasts this time. I'll get there, its just a process to work on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knelson Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 And you know, on our way down, I did see that silver lining for an entire day. It was a day of utter honesty with myself. I'm not kidding. It was beautiful and horrible at the same time. It was quite a gift. Yes... it can be. And it's great that you recognized that "silver linings" may not at first appear to be silver! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 death Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 These datura sound a lot like morning glory seeds Taking drugs may be a shortcut to enlightenment but if the drugs wear off and so does the enlightenment, that's not much help is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 There's always hope in flashbacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 The Sound of Joy is Enlightenment - Space, Fire, Truth is Enlightenment - Space Fire - Sometimes it's Music - Strange Mathematics - Rhythmic Equations - The Sound of Thought is Enlightenment - The Magic Light of Tomorrow - Backwards are those of Sadness - Forward and Onward Are those of Gladness - Enlightenment Is my Tomorrow - It has no planes of Sorrow - Hereby, my Invitation - I do invite you be of my Space World - This Song is Sound of Enlightenment - The Fiery Truth of Enlightenment - Vibrations come from the Space World - Is of the Cosmic Starry Dimension - Enlightenment is my Tomorrow - It has no planes of Sorrow - Hereby, our Invitation - We do invite you to be of our Space World. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 WOW, maaaaannnnnnn... That's like givin' me heavy deja vu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottP Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 More cowbell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catbirdseat Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 These datura sound a lot like morning glory seeds Taking drugs may be a shortcut to enlightenment but if the drugs wear off and so does the enlightenment, that's not much help is it? Oh, so you are saying that true enlightenment is an enduring state, not just a transient experience? Way to take the wind out of guy's sails! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Once you reach Nirvana, you step off the Wheel of Karma.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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