Required Reading

[Fat_Teddy]

Required reading.

[icegirl]

Great link! Thanks!

[chucK]

Yeah shit! We're nowhere NEAR 600K dead yet! Bring it on...

 

and onner and onner.

 

Why be deterred?!!

 

Were the Soviets deterred in Afghanistan? NO!

 

Were we deterred in Viet Nam? NO!

 

Well, not for like 10 years and many many deaths and we/they were totally losing anyway.

 

Let's return to the simple times of the civil war. Why wallow in recent, more relevant, history when we can think back a century ago of an uplifting example of how we perservered through a half-million dead.

 

woo hoo

[Fat_Teddy]

ChucK obviously didn't understand it. I'll try to scare him up a pop-up book edition. One he can finish before he comments.

[chucK]

I stand by my comments.

 

Apparently you think there was something more there than an attempt to support the war in Iraq by criticizing those who would decry the problems with it, and by minimizing the damages by comparing it to a much bloodier spectacle.

 

I'm curious, as to what your take on that piece, if you really think that my interpretation is flawed. Please, see if you can conjure up a cliff-note version for me as you seemed to have offered in your condescending way.

[Fat_Teddy]

Of course you do.

 

It's a take on the idiots who trump up minor flaws and use them to overshadow the greater good. It's a stab at morons who cry about the injustices of Abu Grhaib, and use them as examples of the failures, rather than talk of the good. It's a call for the naysayers to shut the hell up and do some good, rather than sit within the safety the troops provide and criticize them.

 

It's a call for people like you to don a uniform and serve your country, rather than sit back and cry foul over situations you've never been in. Rather than insult the memory who have given it all so you can sleep at night, while you're too scared to walk in their boots. It's asking people like you to shut the hell up, one day a year, and remember my friends who actually know what honor, God, and country means.

[chucK]

"It's a take on the idiots who trump up minor flaws and use them to overshadow the greater good."

 

Minor flaws = couple thousand dead or injured americans. Greater good = avenging Bush father, dropping the ball on Al Qaeda and making us all more vulnerable to terrorists

 

"It's a stab at morons who cry about the injustices of Abu Grhaib, and use them as examples of the failures, rather than talk of the good."

 

I have not characterized Abu Grhaib as a failure; rather, as an inevitable consquence of this war. That this war was ever prosecuted is the failure.

 

"It's a call for the naysayers to shut the hell up and do some good, rather than sit within the safety the troops provide and criticize them."

 

We can all do some good if we get us out of there, or at the very least get our incompetent commander in chief out of there.

 

"It's a call for people like you to don a uniform and serve your country,"

 

Unless you're over there right now, this sounds pretty damn hollow.

[Fat_Teddy]

Minor flaws = couple thousand dead or injured americans.

 

Those aren't even flaws. They're products of war.

 

Greater good = avenging Bush father, dropping the ball on Al Qaeda and making us all more vulnerable to terrorists

 

When was the last time Al Qaeda hit the US?

 

We can all do some good if we get us out of there, or at the very least get our incompetent commander in chief out of there.

 

We're doing good now. The fact that you can't see that brings us back to my original point, your lack of comprehension.

 

Unless you're over there right now, this sounds pretty damn hollow.

 

Of course it does to you, sitting in WA basking in the freedom that I helped provide, criticizing people doing something you're too scared to do yourself.

[cracked]

ChucK, I don't understand how the Iraq war makes us more vulnerable to terrorists. Would you mind explaining?

[chucK]

It diverted us from taking them out in Afghanistan, and ties up our military from reacting to them anywhere other than Iraq.

It has lowered our standing in the world to such a low that we have less political power to find Al Qaeda in other countries.

All the wonderful PR has bred Al Qaeda recruits and sympathizers.

[Fat_Teddy]

It has lowered our standing in the world to such a low that we have less political power to find Al Qaeda in other countries

 

Like where? Pakistan? Libya? Did you even read the link I posted?

[chucK]

Minor flaws = couple thousand dead or injured americans.

 

Those aren't even flaws. They're products of war.

Thank you for supporting our troops.

[chucK]

Qooh yeah. We've really got things under control in Pakistan.

 

Do you even read the real news?

[Fat_Teddy]

Qooh yeah. We've really got things under control in Pakistan.

 

Are you serious? Do you even follow world politics? Pakistan was the chief supporter of the taliban. Now they're one of our leading allies in the region. That's even in the "fake" news.

 

Do you even read?

 

Thank you for supporting our troops.

 

I've BEEN our troops, idiot. When you get the balls to don a uniform and stand a freaking post, then I'll accept your criticism. Until then, you're just another liberal coward crying about people doing a job you don't have the balls to do.

[jordop]

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Edited June 8, 2021 by jordop

[Fat_Teddy]

So this is where Steyn ended up after getting the boot from the National Post for being such a moronically sentimental right wing buffoon

 

Really? That's not what Matthew Fraser says. He also says readers were "disgruntled by Steyn's absence. It sounds like even the liberal rags wanted him.

[jordop]

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Edited June 8, 2021 by jordop

[icegirl]

if we were done in Afghanistan, and "distracted" by Iraq, then why is my brother headed over there in a few months?? My cousin just got back a few weeks ago and had some pretty chilling tales, but GET THIS, he has volunteered to go back as soon as he can (there OR iraq), because he believes in why we are there, and he is NOT some idiot 19 year old without an education.

[Fat_Teddy]

Editor Ken Whyte and managing editor Martin Newland got fired. Rats left sinking ship. Steyn was made to feel unwelcome. Paper dies more every day, just like Blackie. Still has good arts reporting though, oddly

 

Hmmm, I thought you said he got "the boot from the National Post for being such a moronically sentimental right wing buffoon"

 

You weren't lying were you?

[chucK]

pakistan

[jordop]

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Edited June 8, 2021 by jordop

[gotterdamerung]

Running at the mouth again folks?

 

Home ten days from the great adventure, and I see nothing here worth fighting for. Since some Americans don't really seem to give a great fuck about the boys over there other than to engage in useless pillow talk over the net.

 

If you really want to show your stripe get your ass out the peace rally so I can detain and arrest you and give a nice taste of homegrown prison in your backyard. What we need around here are more Pelican Bays. Shoe program dissenter!

[Fat_Teddy]

Well if I read in one paper that he was fired and in another that he quit, I'm going to go with the story that supports my biases on life and perpetuiate that version of life in all my dealings with people to further my vision of history. I do what I can.

 

Could you post a link to that?

[catbirdseat]

The article suggested that "back then" the people didn't criticize the judgement of those running the government. If you don't think Lincoln wasn't criticized for his actions during the Civil War, you better go do some reading. Lincoln had a huge number of detractors who fought him tooth and nail. The country was divided. It was only through his keen political skills that Lincoln was able to stay the course.

[jordop]

Quote

Quote

Well if I read in one paper that he was fired and in another that he quit, I'm going to go with the story that supports my biases on life and perpetuiate that version of life in all my dealings with people to further my vision of history. I do what I can.

 

Could you post a link to that?

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Edited June 8, 2021 by jordop