Denali Boot Dilemma

[slogon]

I'm trying to like up some boots for Denali, with warmth (and fit) being key (along with weight and cost, of course). Options I'm looking at: 1) Koflach Artis Expe, 2) Koflach Degre with Intuition liners, 3) the new Vasque Ice 9000. Any thoughts on how warm the Intuition liners compare to the Arctis Expe's liners, and if the Vasques (which are supposed to be very light and warm) are worth going through the extra trouble of mail order to get?

[Mtguide]

I'm not familiar with the Intuition Liners,or the Vasque;but the Koflach Degre,while very light,isnt' really intended for the demands of Denali,and might be too light in construction.I'd opt for the Arctis Expedition,for fit,as well as durability.The Degre,which I've used for a wide range of general mountaineering,including ice climbing,is a softer boot,not quite as " articulate" a feel to it as the Arctis.,IMHO.

Edited January 3, 2004 by Mtguide

[griz]

Yeah, you can't beat the Arctis Expe for denali. I spent two weeks in them there and didn't have any foot problems at all... No blisters or even hot spots and cozy on summit day w/ 40below overboots. Best money you'll ever spend, dude.

I do know 2 people that climbed denali in the degre's, as well. Both summited in them w/o problems and using overboots. They are your toes though and I'd shell out the extra $ for abit more protection, ya know? It's pretty fuckin' cold there...

[Marko]

Intuition liners are freakishly warm and comfy if you get an experienced person to fit them for you. Erik at Marmot spent a good chunk of time fitting mine and the result was zero heel lift and toasty feet while ice climbing in -30°C last winter. My partner's feet were blocks of freakin' wood.

They are pretty stiff laterally however.

[pete_a]

Intuition liners are as warm if not warmer than the Koflach Arctis liners...I used Dynafit randonee boots with Intuition liners in them on my Denali trip and they were plenty warm-still used 40 below overboots on summit day though.

I've had Koflach Degre boots for several years, when the liners packed out I bought new arctis exped liners for my old degre shells and thats worked fine for me on climbs this past year.

If you can find a pair of used Koflach shells that are the right size, you can buy a new pair of Artis Exped liners for $125 and your total cost will probably be way less than that avg price for new Artis Exped boots.

[Alex]

Any thoughts on how warm the Intuition liners compare to the Arctis Expe's liners

 

When I was in the area in 1998, I had a pair of Koflch Arctis boots while most of my friends had the custom foam intuition liners. Without a doubt, the Intuition liners are warmer. The Koflachs are fine down to around -30C with some extra sole insulation if you need it, but I would go intuition liners.

 

If you can find a pair of used Koflach shells that are the right size, you can buy a new pair of Artis Exped liners for $125 and your total cost will probably be way less than that avgprice for new Artis Exped boots.

 

very good advice, that

 

Alex

[Hoosier_JB]

Hey Marko, Pete and any others with experience, knowledge or an opinion - what do you think about using the Intuition liner with the Degre shell for a climb like McKinley? How would that set up compare with the one you describe Pete with the Degre shell and Exped liner?

 

Thanks!

[pete_a]

I've monkeyed around with shoving my intuition liners into my koflach shells and I noticed that the intuition (thermoflex-whatever you want to call them) liners are thicker than the koflach liners so I can't use the liners for my ski boots in my koflach boots.

But if you can get the sizing of the shell and liner right to fit your foot using a Degre (or any) plastic shell with an Intuition liner that would work fine in my opinion (and for what its worth Mark Twight recommends using thermoflex-intuition liners instead of stock liners for plastic boots in Extreme Alpinism)

PS-

There was a thread on telemarktips.com this fall regarding a source for really cheap thermo liners -made by Intuition for Morrow snowboards- if they still have them in stock it could save you a lot of money

 

thread on teletips:

http://www.telemarktalk.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=12210&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

 

company thats selling the liners:

http://www.cheapsnowboards.com/csstore.html

[willstrickland]

They still have them, but $10 now instead of $5. I got a pair, and they run kinda big as Pete said. They don't fit my Alpha shells (could probably make them fit though by ordering a size small, and taking a knife to the upper section), but they work like a charm in my snowboard boots. Kept my feet plenty warm at 0degF this weekend.

[tomtom]

I baked a pair of the Morrow/Intuition liners for my Koflach Verticals. They were great for ice climbing at 4 deg this weekend.

[Alpinfox]

They still have them, but $10 now instead of $5.

 

$20 instead of $10 now.

[pete_a]

capitalism...haha

 

the price was better when shipping was more than the liners themselves. still not a bad deal though.

[Figger_Eight]

I stuck Intuition liners in my Exped's and those worked fine, but did so because the original liners were packed out.

 

The Exped's and the Degre's shells are quite similar in materials HOWEVER the Exped's are sized for more volume to accomodate the liner expanding at altitude. If you have Degre's that are sized snug for good frontpointing and alpine climbing, you might run into that problem. If you have to buy new boots, the stock liner in the Exped's will be fine if you stick an overboot over them for up high. My .02 cents at least.