Wastral

An excellent slightly longer climb is NE buttress of Triumph. A whopping 15 feet of 5.7 easily protected with several pitches of low fifth but mostly clean 4th and 3rd class. It really requires 2 ropes to get down though no matter what Jim says in his book. Had to bail a second team off the mountain with our ropes last time I was up there. Views can't be beat. Don't even need glacier gear anymore as the route to the buttress doesn't even cross it anymore but goes under it. A nice weekend climb. Go up Sloan. Clean rock nothing over 5.6/5.7 for a little bit. Great views. Lots of elevation gain though. Another super easy "weekend" climb would be S. Buttress of Thomspson. If in decent shape do it in a day. Some people call it the w. buttress, but that is just stupid as it points south not west. Anyways, off the soap box. Its a very easy straightforward route, BUT, it has MONSTER exposure for a newbie who is not used to it. DO NOT TAKE someone up it who is not used to exposure/heights. It is also a bit loose 3rd at the top. Just go straight up the ridge. Lower section is nice clean rock. Upper not so nice. Prussic peak would be a great couple pitch clean climb on its west ridge. 5.6 I think. Forbidden is a super easy climb also. Brian

Well damn, what is the world coming too, not using a gri-gri for belaying, oh no! I still have the Original freedom of the Hills, the second edition and I might add the 5th? The first 2 editions all have the hip belay as the primary belaying method. Guess all climbers died before 1970. Guess there was never a vertical route put up before 1970 either... Lets see, when was Liberty Crack put up on Liberty bell? Oh yea, 1965 Wastral

Sure, That is the way I did Forbidden the first time. Took the 4th class gully to the west of the main normal 1st ascent gulley. Once you get out of that west gulley its easy 3rd class terrain to the ridge then 4th on the ridge with a couple moves of low fifth on the upper ridge itself. Brian

Well, guess I will have to try the ol' hip belay on truely vertical rock sometime here. That is if marymoor doesn't count, which I think it does, at least for practice! I have climbed with 3 people and its a PITA, but have never actually belayed 2 at once since never wanted 2 ropes dragging me down when leading. I suppose this is easily attainable when using dual twin lead ropes of the 8mm variety. Always hate the rope management problems when at a climbing ledge with 3 people/2ropes. Hmm, maybe when I go to Waddington next summer, or try for waddington again next summer, I can lighten my climbing equipment and simply leave the ATC at home. Carabiners work fine for repelling as well. Brian

"left america" Soooo, Canada isn't in america eh? Must have flown to Europe first then back into Canada?? Brian

I was in pro mountain sports and saw a guy swipe a $60 cam and run out the door. Didn't have a backpack either... True, at FF climbing equip is behind the desk, but people are turds, and stealing a $200 down coat would be simplistic with a backpack. Sorry, life sucks

+1 to Tvas enough said Wastral

Well if any of you guys would ask a certain local climbing legend whom used nothing but the hip belay for the last 50+ years your comments might be a tad different. Ever heard of Fred Becky? No one even used a stitch plate/ATC till the 1960s. PS Joseph wasn't talking about belaying roof climbs sitting at a hanging belay station. For almost 100% of alpine, a correct hip belay is far superior to an ATC which is very slow in comparison. For pure rock climbing big walls it is different. I don't think Joseph is telling folks to use a hip belay on vertical multipitch rock walls. PPS when training at marymoor, I will use a hip belay and carabiner most of the time. It is VERY easy, it puts very little strain on your hands since you are not fighting the rope pulling it through the $#*%$))$)(#)(#)(_$)_#)_$# ATC to give slack to the lead climber. Or when on top, pulling the rope through the #*$#)(#))(@)#()(#)(@_@!_+@)$#%$%#$$ ATC. True, you have to wear a shirt or get rope burn on your back! A hip belay deos require one to pay attention to what you are doing!

I own an Astraplane and a Gregory Denali pro. The denali pro whoops the astraplane in every category. Carries better. Distrubutes weight about the same, but it wins hands down on functionaility by a GIGANTIC MARGIN. Denali pro you can take the top pocket off and use it as a summit sack. Denali doesn't have that stupid internal webbbing to transfer the load. In otherwords it doesn't crush your food. Gregory has attachment points for attaching Skis, astraplane does not. On top of that the Gregory pack does not have that stupid zipper on the side that lets water in. Either pack is gigantic and you had better be going for longer than 2 weeks because they both weigh 8lbs whereas my 50L pack weight in at 3 or lighter. Best thing about the astraplane is its 2 back pockets instead of gregory's 1 and that is the only nice thing.

If its raining why do you have a down jacket on and moving? You will be in camp. If you are moving you will never have a down jacket on because u will be sweating faster than a pig dodging the butcher. If you are moving and its raining... getting out of dodge... then your rain jacket over medium layer will be more than warm enough, probably will take it off and you will be dryer and warmer. If snowing and moving a medium layer and a waterproof will be plenty, unless in maybe alaska... In which case the layering system is completely different than down here. Snow will blow right off the volant jacket to boot. Eventually if it is close to freezing then some of the snow will melt and penetrate the volant... I have its kid brother. ANyways, if its snowing and you are moving you won't be wearing down either because you will sweat it out and make it useless. Down is to be used in camp only. One can argue that if you are traveling very light then you should not carry down at all since if you are cold get in your sleeping bag when the weather is bad. If winter time and camping with a tarp then down clothing is great! Brian

Just bought yourself 2 30m ropes... Great for moderate alpine climbing. =) Or belaying at Marymoor! My "30m" ropes were caused by a rock, yours came prefabbed =)

Personally, you want a tent with extra length for storing crap, and a vestibule so you can cook. The length comes in handy for drying clothes slings etc. If you rub against the side it isn't a tent as far as I am concerned. Just an emergency shelter may as well take a bivy sack and save weight. AKA the BD firstlight. Fine for a weekend, anything longer and your sleeping bag is screwed along with you. If you are really high up, where you don't get condensation because it freezes as ice particles,then any tent will work as long as it withstands the wind. Anywhere else in the world, AKA all of North America/Alps/New Zealand, you will have condensation more often than not. Brian

Rope up. Its good practice. One can get completely roped up in under 15 minutes if you are moving slowly, under 5 minutes if you already have your harness on. Besides you need to drink water and put on sunscreen right? Anytime anyone in the group feels awkward, rope up. Its fast and easy. You are all moving at the same speed anyways. Humor aside: The only exception to roping up is when you are confident that if one guy slips he will simply pull the other guy to his death. In which case, STOP, retreat, or decide to belay very short sections. Remember snow does not hold like ROCK PRO! For instance in super slush/super steep powder or if you don't have enough pro for a steep section of 45 degree hard snow/ice. Not enough pro and continuing climbing is just to make yourself feel good. Go up to alpental, the upper ski section (almost 35-40 degree snow), and practice catching someone elses fall with a heavy pack on your back while your partner is headed down the hill on his back. Good luck. I have been in super thigh deep 45 degree slush, and we should have unroped, because if one slipped the other could never have stopped the fall. In fact in such conditions the rope just gets in the way and tends to pull the lead climber off the hill!!! I could barely stand as it was. It was the next thing to wet avalanche conditions. Should have probably stopped, but after a week in a tent... I never roped up going across the Cache "glacier" , Lousy "glacier", triumph "glacier", or the blumps under Forbidden, and numerous other flat "glaciers" because honestly if they aren't large they aren't really glaciers. There are exceptions of course. Heck we jumped into the "crevasses" on under Forbidden because they made nice "chairs" for resting on our way up. They(glaciers labeled on the map) were jokes in other words. Any long trip in mountain country, I always wear my harness 100% of the time anyways for extra padding and the rope is sitting in the pack so may as well use it if you are traveling over steep snow or glaciers. Brian

Nice, now make that same map into spire measure. =) Then we get to see how much work it is to the top of each peak. Brian

North side has possible good turns either to Gold Lake true north or North west back towards Hester Lake. Last time I was up there in June and snow level went all the way down to Gold Lake. Brian

Awesome trip in great conditions guys!!! Can't wait to quit working and actually get to enjoy awesome winter conditions! On a side note... Always enjoy pics of well used old school friends... Nice "tie-off." Isn't it a lot cheeper to tie off with webbing instead of the rope??? My wallet says ouch, if a guy fell right there off belay. Brian

I was originally looking for avalanche stuff. How I found the others I dont know. The related window would be my guess. At the time I was watching the after reports of an avalanche where someone had died and they were investigating the snow pack for why, what, where, and how it happened. Brian

The youtube videos were posted from the AMGA guys. I forgot to put that in there. Oops. They also have videos demonstrating rope management, abalakov anchors, avalanche preparedness, Pro placement, rack useage, etc. Brian

60m rope = ~200feet If 40 feet apart in your scenario you have 200 -80 =120 div by 2 = 60feet coils on lead/rear guy So have 60 feet +40 feet = 100ft of rope 84 feet is used as drop loop due to streching of the rope leaves you 16 feet to make z and tie packs and yourselves to ground. Say an 8 foot z(2:1) = 16 feet, anything shorter and you can barely get the rope stretch out of the system before resetting. Can't even make a 3:1(z on a z)for a 6:1 with the drop loop. Leaves you negative feet to pull with and tie yourselves in on a 2:1 on a drop loop making a 3:1. A knot for the anchor takes another 2 feet out leaving you with minus 2 feet to pull with. For a total of minus 4 feet since with using prussics as hand grabs only takes 2 feet of rope to pull with. Of course who goes in 3 man climbing groups??? No one. Not to mention your scenario doesn't work. Takes 1 leg 1 arm to prussic out anyways. So, if we assume he can't prussic out then he can't attach the loop either and you are sending a climber down for first aid and piggy backing him on your back. Brian PS. Yes, some teachers know what they are talking about, but it still means one must contemplate what they say and take what they say with a grain of salt PPS. Youtube is a great spot to learn crevasse rescue placement and how to due basic avalanche awareness training.

To Joseph PH: I have stated previously that I don't blieve that ANY corporate CEO or officer should make more than 10x what the average worker makes. The only exception would be someone who created their own company like Bill Gates who took all the risk to make the company work. IN that case they should be able to make whatever their hearts desire. This corporate thievery by top exectutives has got to stop. Its thievery couched in "contract" terms. They destroy the company in the long term to make the company look good in the short so they can take their bonus's and run. Brian

Try posting actual reasons where you would actually ever use a drop loop system instead of calling names. In your own post you put that they hardly ever use the drop loop system. As I pointed out there is ALWAYS a faster and safer way to do crevasse rescue in all situations than the drop loop system. Once again, you guys never state how, why, or where you would use a Drop loop system. Just claim others teach it and its good. I have run into many tweedle-des and tweedle-dums in the mountaineers etc who were "teachers". Why would anyone take someones word on something just because they say so and happen to "teach" something. Use your brain, don't be lazy, think it through for yourselves. Just because a teacher says something doesn't mean they know anything, just means they can repeat what they have been told. Its a proven fact that women can hold multiconversations at once wheras most men cannot. Thus, once again I stated fact, while you guys turn to name calling. Brian

Efficiency as regards to pullies is as others have pointed out, High School physics. Ok background: 2 types of friction 1) Static friction 2) Rolling friction 3) Static friction is always greater than rolling friction When talking pulley efficiency, carabiner or pullies with or without bearings, we are talking about rolling friction. Static friction is when the system is at rest. Static friction is not all that big of a deal in Crevasse rescue because the rope is a dynamic rope and stretches allowing different parts of the system to move at different speeds at startup, obviously if you pull at a constant speed this is a mute point. But, one never pulls at a constant speed. You pull in herks and jerks. In otherwords, the guy in the hole is not moving even though you are pulling on the rope at the begining of your pull cycle. Thus, you jump past the static friction problem at pts. 1 and 2. Where static friction is a concern, is at pulley #3 where the force is the highest. A bearing pulley will ALWAYS have far lower static and rolling friction. Thus, why I stated that if you yave two pullies they should be at points 1 and 3. Point 1 to overcome efficiency ripple. Point 3 to overcome Static friction startup problems. Brian PS. I have run into lots of Tweedle-de and tweedle-dumbs. PPS. I put in my replies because some completely ill informed guys replied to my posts trying to postulate that the drop loop system is actually rational. As I rationally proved, its not. Didnt see you castigating them, since you agree with them for some reason which you never give. Just think that reading my posts is like talking to women. I reply to more than 1 post at a time since I dont check every 5 minutes for replies.

Well, when a kid from High School with 0 job experience can make $50k a year in the car and aerospace industry, while a college engineering graduate makes the same, something is wrong... Its called union Yes, I agree, litigation is also a huge concern. As far as I am concerned, the judge should be allowed to rule against the litigator for twice the damages they were seeking from the defendant when its clear its a complete BS case. Like the McDonalds coffee case and umpteen millions of other cases. It would clear up our legal system in a jiffy. Brian

Havent had a trade surplus since 1975. We have been using inflation and a huge national debt to cover this fact. The chickens have finally come home to roost. Look what a good 2000 square foot house cost in 1975. $35,000 Now, its $200,000. That is a 5x to 6x inflation in 30 years. Pretty sad. Food prices have been subsidized by the feds, thus they have remained low. In other words, they inflated the dollar so we keep buying less and less even though our consumption(imports) from outside of the USA are increasing. Its called an unstable system. Just a matter of time before the chickens start crapping all over the parade. Brian

Any pulley system. If the input pulley(where you pull from) has a 0% efficiency(stuck, not moving), then 0 force gets applied to the second pulley because the first pulley is not rolling, thus the rope would be sliding. Thus, horrible efficiency. A good example of this is the "revolver" pulley on a carabiner that they sell in local shops. It will spin under light loads, but under a real load the shaft bends and it locks up, making it a horrible idea to use as a second "pulley" for crevasse rescue. Brian