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"Josh (or Red Rocks) is pretty much grade V-" Nice!!! Though I'd give JT a full grade V.

Yeah, COR is not a good winter/early spring destination IMHO. Drove by there 1.5 weeks ago and the general area was kind of nasty - fog and freezing cold. 2 yrs. ago went out there in mid-April and it was nice in the sun. Would not go want to go there earlier than mid to late April (but if you're heading down to Moab, you can pass by on the way).

Go for Moab. You feel like cragging, you can hit Indian Creek (haven't been there) for example. You feel in the mood for some adventure, you bag a tower. Aid, free, easy, hard - anything can be found there. Delta has direct connection to SLC (closest big airport) and they had these 50% off deals recently if you want to fly (about $150/person rt used to be). Or better yet, go with my driving plan above and you can still bag something short the afternoon you get there(Ancient Art/Stolen Chimney is a nice 2 hr climb, 20 minutes form the car and considered a NA Classic to give you an example). One place you can camp is in Castle Valley (TH for Castleton area). There might be other, better places to camp. If weather there turns to crap, head to Red Rocks.

If we're brainstorming here, think about Dragoon Mountains/Cochise Stronghold in SE Arizona. It's just about the same drive as to JT (c. 1400 miles) but w/o the hassles of JT. Camping is at large (real nice) and free. Beautiful granite climbing up to about 6-8 pitches in length. Good weather (as good as JT at least I'd think). Been there twice so could tell you whatever I remember about the place if you decide to go there. Post on what you decide. PS As you can tell, I need to do a road trip (getting way into this )

"What’s the best way to travel there from Portland?" Might consider driving thru. Vegas and checking out Red Rocks along the way - you might not even want to continue once you get a taste of those grade III and up sandstone beauties If you leave after work say 6pm from PDX, push it into the evening hours to southern Idaho, it's easy enough to finish the drive to Las Vegas by early afternoon the next day (depending on time of the year, might be able to squeeze in a warm-up pitch still). From Vegas to JT is about 3-4 hours if I remember right (nice drive too). If you're thinking of flying there, again, think about flying to LV (can get some cheap deals for direct flights from PDX on Alaska or America West) and car rentals in LV are dirt cheap compared to other places. One time we tried JT, we hit reall sh.t weather and did not climb anything so can't help you with other questions. PS are you really set on JT? there's better places to escape the wet portland weather with less driving and for finer climbing IMHO. Thinking Moab here. Only 14 hrs (950 miles). Camping is free.

It gets mighty warm on sun-exposed faces during the day...Africa hot!! We stayed at that KOA campground and it SUCKED!!!! Expensive and you have a bunch of RV's, ATV's, and other white t*ash paraphenalia making noise into late hours of the night. There's got to be better options but I don't know where. There's a general store right there as well (basics). Check the summitpost Devil's Tower page - got lots of good route info. from Frank Sanders himslef (many FA's on the tower). Some good info. also here: http://www.piquaclimber.com/ and here: http://www.gdargaud.net/ (nice photos!) Oh yeah, as you're hiking down after a day of climbing, keep your gaze down - DON'T make eye contact with the tourists (or pack all your stuff inside the backpack, douse yourself with massive amounts of cologne and make like one of them)...you'll see why after your first day there. Overall a great fun place. Enjoy.

NOLSe - what route is that?

Ditto here. Thanks.

no problem. Only downside to the area could be the summer heat (but then you just head out to the peaks - NM or even CO). I'm guessing that you probably have seen this page before, but this has got to be some of the best (amature) climbing photography on the web (some nice TR's too). Check out the AZ, UT, NV etc.. sections on the page: http://www.gdargaud.net/Climbing/index.html

Check out the route photos (no TR's) from the Dragoons: http://homepage.mac.com/forest/PhotoAlbum82.html That temple I had in mind above is called Zoraster Temple. Here's a couple of shots from The Mace tower (Sedona): http://www.naclassics.com/climbs/mace/beta.htm

I guess it sort of depends on what you have in mind when you say "nearby". There's tons of stuff that I know of if you're willing to put in a bit of driving time on weekends. South of you (SE AZ, ~1h E. from Tuc.) is the Dragoon Mountains/Cochise Stronghold. Tons of quality granite domes - stuff up to about 8 pitches in length and w. generally short approaches. Get yourself that S. Arizona Rock Climbs by Kerry guidebook. Also in S. Arizona is Baboquivari Peak and many other large domes. West of you is Sedona with its classic sandstone towers (Mace etc...). Granite Mountain outside of Prescott, AZ is also somewhere there. Phoenix area apparently has a ton of crags incl. Mt. Lemon I think? Backcountry? Head further west and do some stuff in Grand Canyon. Forgot the name of it now, but there is this "Temple" there with a supposedly nice 5.9 to the top. There are probably others. Red Rocks (Vegas) ain't that far either. Neither is Moab. Heard there's lots of godd stuff to the east in New Mexico (Sandias). Hell, looking out the window today I'd jump on this opportunity!

Thank you.

Anyone done these? Nick Dodge is the only source I could find. He lists 3 routes: 2 on the main pillar and one on the lower pillar (easiest summit routes go at 5.7 & 5.7 A2; Dodge makes it sound like each route is about 2 p long). Any additional beta would be appreciated. thanks.

I thought that pitch 2 of Kor-Ingalls was harder (as in more sustained) than pitch 3 and kind of hard for a 5.8. Harder moves on 3rd pitch (lower half to 2/3rds of pitch) but some decent rest stances and once in the chimney on the upper 3rd of pitch it feels secure. I also thought that the low 5th squeeze on pitch 1 was pretty nasty - it was so tight I couldn't inhale fully. Not even sure if you're supposed to get INSIDE that slot.

Head out to the desert SW (Moab, some Red Rocks lines & some Sedona Towers) and you'll have the pretty red anodized coloring off that thing in no time Around here from my limited experience I found that #4 Camalot (~#5 Friend) seems to be sufficient "luxury" items. Also, from my limited experience I sort of like Friends better than Camalots in the monster sizes (seem more stable but I do own a #5 Camalot) but those are not on sale.

Went there last Thursday. They've been cleaning out nicely.

Was there the weekend before thanksgiving this year. 1-2 feet of snow and COLD. The main road thru. the park was closed in part. Might have been a freak snow storm.

fenderfour, I'm guessing the missing bolt on the ladder's been replaced? so which variation did you opt for? you must've done it satruday I'm guessing since we did not see anyone on the pillar on sunday (freakin' windy sunday on the west side anyway).

As others have said, that West Face Variation replaces the 1st forgettable pitch of Pioneer Route (c. 5.5) with nice 2 or 3 pitches of .7-.8 climbing. Much more fun option! The Variation itself has like 4 or 5 variations in Watts book. Have done 2 of those, the "13" (3P to Bohn) and "13a" (2P to Bohn). "13a" has better climbing and avoids the horrendous rope drag on P2 of "13". "13" has only one move that could qalify as an .8 (starting P3 you have to move up onto the traverse slab). The best part of "13" is that you can get some awsome shots of your second doing the traverse as you're looking down from Bohn st. French freeing that bolt ladder would be "interesting" - the A0 pitch starts vertical and goes overhangning near the top. Bolts are all shiney new (though there was some mention on the boards that one of them popped out last fall). This seems like the ideal place to get a first taste of very easy aiding. Have not done the 5.8 bolted variation to Panic Point pitch. I'd imagine it would be stellar - you get all the benefits of the standard Panic Point pitch but replace the forgettable low 5th scramble above with a super exposed face climb (this BTW is called Monkey Off My Back). There's got to be a million TR's on the web on the Pioneer route and half a million on west face variation Couple examples: http://www.mountainwerks.org/mwp/climbing/smithrock.htm (nice photos of pioneer route) http://www.summitpost.org/show/mountain_link.pl/mountain_id/1695 (pioneer and w. face var. photos) http://www.dingomt.com/SmithRock/MonkeyFace/monkey.htm (pioneer route) http://smithrock.com/flash/routeupdates/monkey_back.html (monkey off my back) Enjoy.

ORScrambles, Please tell me more about it now that you've peaked my curiosity. What other peaks are in the book - esp. curious about SE Oregon ones & any other less-traveled ones. Thanks! Looking forward to buying that baby in Spring '05!

Might get more response on that idahosummits.com message board. The first two you mention look pretty awsome. Wondering if Elephants Perch store in Ketchum, ID might have some beta for you (then again it might be kind of out of their region). Good luck and looking forward to a TR.

Two yrs. ago or so I heard rummors that some lady was writing an OR scrambles book. I'm guessing that it would not cover anything over class 3 (Wallowa/Cascades/Elkhorns scrambles?). Would love to see an updated Dodge or Thomas -type guidebooks. Orton is supposedly working on 2nd edition to his (excellent IMHO) book that will incorporate Jim Anglin's Menagerie guide. On the flip side, having old Dodge or Thomas guides as your ONLY sources for beta makes for some rewarding pinnacle bagging / choss thrashing. So what happened to Watts's updated edition ?

The two guys mentioned that they got an 'OK' from the state park to put up a route there. Guess I can stop looking up at that face trying to pick out the line/bolts now. thanks.

In early '03 (maybe it was '02?), I saw two guys putting in a bolt 20 feet up at Beacon at the place where the base is closest to hwy/parking lot. that would be I guess NE corner. they mentioned that they're putting up a new route. wondering if anyone got any info. on it - has it been completed?

Thank you very much - appreciate the detailed information. (also thanks to NOLSe for mentioning the right source).