Kimmo

and Obama is continuing to prop up this house of cards and bullshit "we deserve more than we could possibly afford" attitude now seriously, what do you fine intelligent folk see as the outcome here? sure we're going deeper in debt, but still less as a % of gdp than back during that last great american war. and bonds continue to sell at lower than expected interest rates. and what, our debt is comparable to the entire EU as a whole? no, the present trajectory seems a bit ummm untenable, but where do you see it exactly going? ok bonds start to bid at higher and higher interest rates....

i must add that in no way was i ridiculing what you do for a living. hell, i'm not even sure that you actually rob graves; i'm just going by what others have said! and what do i do for a living? take care of a new baby and bolt new sport climbs!

i don't know this choada boy fellow; what are the marks of his ignorance? i must publicly declare that what i do for a living has nothing to do with desecrating graves. whether or not this makes what i do for a living interesting? oi vei, i don't know. i imagine grave robbing could be a pretty darn good time!

were you in the black panthers in the '60's? i would suggest though that the next time your kin attempt to start getting all desecratory on some pristine grave somewhere, that you pop in indiana jones and the raiders of the lost ark in protest. yes, that is what you should do.

i'm surprised to hear that. j tree is one area i strongly support bolt limitations, if not even removal in many cases. perhaps some voices can make a diff. the crags around here, not so much. nothing around here approaches j tree's sacredness, imo. my favorite crag at the moment is buried in a cluster of trees in the middle of a clear cut, 30 degrees overhanging for 60 to 80 feet, and it's a grid of bolts. hella fun, no one's ever gonna see it, and where it's at i support full grid bolting!

i'd say that there are things you might do "for the cause" if you feel so strongly. i don't know what level your engagement is in a public policy process sense, but i'd rather a person work towards their ideals even if i might disagree with them. kind of a principle thing. joshua tree adopted a pretty sensible management plan, if i remember right....

glad to hear that. nothing like climbin with a good vibe on! just to add, i've been siked on all climbing, from solos to trad to big walls etc., each one appealing to me in different ways at different times. last few years it's been all about sport and bouldering though. i think pure physical difficulty has always appealed to me, simply because of the challenge it presents, and having that challenge evolve. i fully appreciate the different challenge that your pursuit offers too: engaging in a very different way.

eh, not really if those 25 feet are the ones that intimidate the person. climbing the suggested pitches above could be good prep.

yeah but to compare the perceived cognitive limitation to that of said 15 year old's.... oh well, it's the internet, right?

yeah cuz it's about the individual's perception, and for whoever that perception still exists, it's "alive". and i think joe has become jaded and allows what he disagrees with to ruin it for him. he can't make climbing his own, so he's imprisoned by others. this mindset would follow him i think to the most pristine cliffs. that's why dosing might help him, to let go of his imprisoning perceptions?

not a matter of him being "cool" or not, regardless of who you are referring to....

whatsup? he's an eager 16 year old kid, right? kinda cold, methinks.

i seem to be one of the few of what one might call sportos here who can at least sense where joe is coming from, and from that place, i would say climbing is dead. it isn't adventure in that sense anymore. it's a very different experience for most people, i'd say, but i doubt it was the way joe sees it for the majority even in his heyday. even so, i have great sympathy of sorts for what i see as the death of his vision. perhaps he can simply dose before climbing? do you really climb without chalk?

i'd somewhat agree on p3 of GM; there are some similarities to gendarme, but i remember p3 being much harder. so in other words, go do p3 and if you get it, you won't have any problems on gendarme! i also seem to remember something kinda similar by the great northern slab, above the corner crack (aries?). kinda awkward overhanging wide weird thingy rated 5.9 and really short, mebbe sorta like the hardest part of the gendarme, but it's been many years so i might be entirely wrong....

Keep talking about "W" while B-HO drives us to complete bankruptcy. bah. US treasury bonds are highly desirable, with no end in sight.

nothing like that threat to keep one straight....

if yer talking to me, i think anderson posted one years ago.

umm are yo usure it wasn't pink? i'm pretty sure he spoke of doing these things at some point....

2 days of climbing followed by a 3 or 4 mile death march with my wife on an urban trail. I tryed to carry extra water for ballast, thinking I could out hike her like always. Shes been training regularly on trail hiking and running and she ground me into the dust. so there might be something else at work besides age! do not become a conscript. btw, try the konings hoeven quadruple trappist ale, since you speak of drinking.

are you talking about dolomite tower right next, or mt baring proper? dolomite has, from what i understand, a rap route down (but it does not follow vanishing point through the roof). per off white's suggestion, bb would know, or pm matt_anderson on this site (if he posts here anymore).

is there a reason for the soreness? do not become a conscript.

private bug, reporting for duty.

i just had a sip of konings hoeven quadrupel trappist ale. it might be the nicest smoothest best balanced ale i have ever tasted. it is truly delightful, and i recommend it to any who enjoy sampling such quaffables.

hmmmm i'm not sure you'd get a lot of disagreement with those, would you? add angora grotto to that list while you're at it, and i'd be happier. i've never met anyone who agreed with the retro bolting of cunning stunt; it pisses me off that it has bolts, when it's a great trad climb. any idea who keeps re-bolting it? anyways, that' a pretty short list, right? hardly something to get all worked up about.... i don't think we in washington have areas as sensitive as say joshua tree, where overbolting creates an eye-sore in a really special place. our crags are pretty isolated and generally pretty chossy and only visited by climbers (ok sure leavenworth is possibly an exception, but i don't notice chalk and bolts when driving through, unlike j tree).

remind me about climbs which fit the above criterion, since i and i'm sure others have no idea which routes you speak of.