colt45

For actual data (which is occasionally a good way to figure things out) check out this website: http://www.yatesgear.com/climbing/screamer/use.htm While it is not explicitly stated on the webpage, it is probably safe to assume that the numbers in the table were determined from drop testing. a specific example of interest: fall factor: 1.4 anchor force: 14 kN with Screamer: 11 kN with Zipper Screamer: 8 kN In this example, a gate-open carabiner will break even with a Screamer. with a Zipper, it may or may not break depending on the specific brand of carabiner. Interestingly, even a #13 stopper would break with a screamer in this case (strength 10 kN). The testing probably uses a totally static belay. Example #2 Fall factor: 0.5 Anchor force: 8 kN With Screamer: 5 kN With Zipper Screamer: 2 kN So without a screamer a #5 stopper (strength 6 kN) would break. With a screamer it would hold. With a zipper even a #1 stopper (strength 2 kN) may hold (although it takes close to 2 kN of force for the zipper to activate in the first place). Based on these numbers, Screamers would be critical pieces of gear in specific situations. The gate flutter issue could certainly be determined experimentally (eg do drop tests with a high-speed camera to see what happens to the bottom biner). Although it does seem like a wiregate would do the trick...?

What's the scoop on crowding of the route? I was hoping to climb HD in a day either mid-June or late August. I'm worried about getting up super early, hiking all the way to the base, and finding 5 other parties ahead of us! Is that a valid concern? If so I would probably bring food & supplies so we could wait it out for a day for the crowds to thin...but I would rather not bring all the extra gear along if the overcrowding is typically not that much of an issue.

Yuko is relatively new to aid climbing. So, what we typically do is I aid a route, fix the rope, and clean while rappelling (leaving a directional or two when necessary). I also fix a separate rope off to the side. Yuko then aids the route, self-belaying on one of the fixed lines with a gri-gri. I go up the other fixed line on ascenders, giving tips if needed. She's getting the system down pretty well, so I'm pretty much hanging out with her up on the wall instead of sitting around on the ground doing nothing. (I have probably done just 20-30 aid pitches in my life, so I'm relatively new to aid too!) After a couple more toprope pitches, she'll probably start to aid lead.

Cool! Thanks for the info. If that pin were still in place it might have been possible for me to continue to the easy nutting. It's good to know that the aid stays reasonable from there on! Since the features in that section are all blank seams with bad pin scars, maybe it has not been done recently as clean aid? In any case, next time I'll try the right variation. If anyone has cleanly aided the straight up variation recently though, please let me know the beta!

Yep, that's the way I was going (#2 stopper near the 3rd blue dot, couldn't get a placement by the 4th blue dot). Do you remember what specific placements you used?

I tried Narrow Arrow on Saturday, and everything was going smoothly up to the first anchor...then I got completely shut down. I was wondering if anyone can supply beta. I had RP's, offsets, cam hooks, etc. Since it is typically confusing to describe a route, here's a photo! The red arrow points to the anchor, which is barely visible (it has an orange sling). Up to here it's all good. Now there is a right-facing corner. The corner has a blank seam with a couple of TINY, severely flaring openings. I tried to use a cam hook, but the crack is too narrow and shallow. I did a big high-step off the bolts, and got an incredibly bad #2 stopper (it's still there if anyone wants it...!), stepped up on that, and there were no placement opportunities at all above. So I stepped up higher and looked to the right--there were a couple of tiny openings in a seam up and right but they were severely flaring and very thin & shallow. It *might* have taken 2 cams of a black alien, but I doubt it. Nothing would stay in, although the #3 HB offset came the closest to being a placement. It looked like even if I got something in, I would be in the same situation again for the next move! So I bailed. I thought this was supposed to be C2. Am I missing something? Or is this just the nature of C2? I have probably done just C1's in the past but have never had a problem at that grade. Afterwards I looked at the route from the parking lot with binoculars. There seems to be a fixed anchor between the first anchor and the big roof. This anchor had completely bleached white slings. The anchor about 50' above the roof had similarly bleached slings. Looks like it hasn't been climbed in a while? Does it really go as clean aid at a reasonable grade? Do I really suck at aid climbing?? (don't answer that one as I already know the likely response). Or do I just need to buy some fancy piece of gear, get better at hooking, etc?

I looked up that first bolted pitch, it is actually called Frank Presley. The 'official' first pitch of Kite, just to its left, looked really blank!

Ahh, splitting hairs on route grades...it's almost as much fun as climbing... Anyway, how about Heart of the Country at Index? The "11a" section is super short, and seems easier than similar low/mid 10's like Pisces, Breakfast of Champions, etc. Maybe my hands happen to be the exact right size or something, I don't know... And I can't imagine Exasperator being any less than solid 10c. To compare to another area, it is definitely more difficult than getting to the first pair of fixed pins on Iron Horse at Index--and this section is given 10b in the Cramer guidebook. Moreover I found Exasperator only slightly easier than the crux of Serenity Crack at Yosemite (10d, originally rated 5.11).

yeah, it wasn't bad. There were pine needles and such, but by stepping carefully I was able to maintain decent footing. My climbing partner suggested adding a whisk broom to the recommended rack for this route!

Of course, footwork is another option. But I would guess that really hard cracks (eg City Park?) do require some serious arm strength. For climbs below 5.12 at least, it seems like honed footwork would be a lot more useful. Extreme strength could conceivably be disadvantageous if it encourages poor technique. In terms of what is higher yield and more fun (for me), I would always choose to do more climbing!

I was there too! Climbed: *Thin Fingers (even took a fall onto an RP--a reminder that it can be good to warm up on something easier...!--then took 2 more laps on TR for redemption), then *GM to Heart of the Country (the 11a finish is quite possibly the softest 5.11 crack ever, unless I misread the topo?), followed by *some 7-bolt 11a with a balancy high-step crux at bolt #3, to *the upper pitch of Kite Flying Blind (I couldn't get the crux section clean, it's pretty tenuous). The weather was ridiculously nice, and all the snow in the surrounding mountains made for a super-dramatic setting. And the rock was perfectly dry, with just a bit of residual moss. I hope we have a few more days like that in the near future!!

If you're looking to work technique without leaving the city, there are several nice boulder-problem cracks at Stone Gardens: hands, vertical. hands, 45 deg overhanging. Off-fingers/tight hands to hands, vertical. Fist, vertical. Doing lots of laps on those, up & down, has significantly improved my climbing on the real thing outdoors. UW rock has a lot of cracks too, although they tend to be pretty challenging b/c they're shallow.

Last I heard, Dave Graham can't do a one-arm...but I have met mediocre climbers who can crank out a couple. Depends on who you want to be.

Ten bucks says you've overextended your hyperbole there chief! hmm, I agree.....what if we make it 5.11? That would be at least somewhat plausible!

Because NSAID's are also under discussion, here is the analagous information for Ibuprofen. Note that neither Cirpo nor Ibuprofen lists the other as having a known interaction (in contrast to what is stated as a "dangerous" combination with "serious" side effects on the law group's website): Indications FDA labeled indications Fever, self-medication of Juvenile rheumatoid arthritis Osteoarthritis Pain, mild to moderate Pain, self-medication of minor Primary dysmenorrhea Rheumatoid arthritis Contraindications hypersensitivity to ibuprofen allergic-type reactions, including asthma or urticaria, to aspirin or nonsteroidal antiinflammatory agents Precautions history of liver dysfunction history of renal disease avoid in late pregnancy hypertension or CHF history of GI ulceration, bleeding or perforation dehydration preexisting anemia history of coagulation defects asthma Adverse Effects COMMON abdominal pain, constipation, diarrhea, dyspepsia heartburn, nausea, stomatitis, vomiting dizziness, drowsiness, headache edema tinnitus rash SERIOUS liver function test abnormalities (<1%), hepatitis (<1%), jaundice (<1%) GI bleeding (<1%), GI perforation (<1%), melena (<1%), pancreatitis (<1%) acute renal failure (<1%), azotemia (<1%), hematuria (<1%) agranulocytosis (<1%), anemia (<1%), thrombocytopenia (<1%), neutropenia (<1%) hypertension (<1%), CHF (<1%) anaphylaxis (<1%) depression (<1%), insomnia (<1%), confusion (<1%), aseptic meningitis (rare) erythema multiforme (<1%), Stevens-Johnson syndrome (<1%) hearing loss (<1%), amblyopia (<1%) Drug Interactions aspirin chaparral clopidogrel comfrey cyclosporine danaparoid eptifibatide fosphenytoin germander ginkgo jin bu huan kava ketorolac levofloxacin lithium loop diuretics low molecular weight heparins meadowsweet methotrexate pennyroyal phenytoin warfarin Pregnancy Category D Breast Feeding safe

Also here is the specific use/warning information from Micromedex that a care provider would see. It looks like tendonitis and tendon rupture are on the "short list" of potential causes for concern: Indications FDA labeled indications Susceptible infections due to E. coli, K. pneumoniae, E. cloacae, P. mirabilis, P. vulgaris, P aeruginosa, H. influenzae, M. catarrhalis, S. pneumoniae, S. aureus (methicillin susceptible), S. epidermidis, S. pyogenes Susceptible infections due to Campylobacter jejuni, Shigella species, Salmonella typhi Anthrax, inhalational - treatment/postexposure prophylaxis Bone and joint infections Febrile neutropenia, empiric therapy Infectious diarrhea Intra-abdominal infections Lower respiratory tract infections Nosocomial pneumonia Prostatitis, chronic bacterial Sinusitis Skin/skin structure infections Typhoid fever Urinary tract infections Contraindications hypersensitivity to ciprofloxacin or other quinolones Precautions alkalinized urine; may result in crystalluria concurrent administration of ciprofloxacin and theophylline; cardiac arrest, seizure, status epilepticus and respiratory failure have occurred elevations in liver function tests excessive sunlight; may cause phototoxicity intracranial pressure elevations known or suspected CNS disorders; may predispose to seizures or lowering seizure threshold neurotoxicity; risk factors include renal failure, underlying CNS disease, and increased CNS penetration of the drug tendonitis; risk factors include patients over 60 years of age, renal failure, dialysis, concomitant corticosteroid therapy, and dyslipidemia Adverse Effects COMMON dizziness, headache, restlessness diarrhea, nausea rash SERIOUS convulsions, increased intracranial pressure, toxic psychosis (rare) serious hypersensitivity reactions (rare) tendon rupture (rare) Drug Interactions aluminum carbonate, basic aluminum hydroxide aluminum phosphate antidiabetic agents azlocillin calcium corticosteroids cyclosporine didanosine dihydroxyaluminum aminoacetate dihydroxyaluminum sodium carbonate dutasteride fennel seed fosphenytoin iron magaldrate magnesium carbonate magnesium hydroxide magnesium oxide magnesium trisilicate phenytoin probenecid rifapentine ropivacaine sucralfate theophylline warfarin zinc Pregnancy Category C Breast Feeding controversial

I may have misinterpreted what you meant by case reports--I thought you were referring to separate reports of individual patient experiences (esentially anecdotal evidence). For example here is an abstract of a peer reviewed article that is NOT particularly informative: --------------------- J Am Podiatr Med Assoc. 2003 Jul-Aug;93(4):333-5 Fluoroquinolones have been associated with tendinopathies. The authors present three cases of Achilles tendinopathy in which the patients' symptoms were preceded by treatment for unrelated bacterial infections with ciprofloxacin. Although the exact mechanism of the relationship is not understood, those who engage in sports or exercise should be advised of the risk of quinolone-induced tendinopathy. ----------------------- Given the large number of people who have been given Cipro you could pick almost ANY random symptom/outcome and find three people who experienced it. You could probably find three case reports of climbers who redpointed their first 5.13 while taking Cipro, and draw the conclusion that Cipro enhances climbing ability. Drug companies do carry out large, expensive studies before a medication is approved for use. Of course post-marketing surveillance via case reports is important to pick up rare side effects, but it is important to have a reasonable number of cases and hopefully some sort of control population. And while the lawyer web site may not be lying outright, they are definitely giving a slanted view of the data. Regarding the British Medical Journal article you cited: the study found ZERO correlation between fluoroquinolone use and tendon injury for people under 60 years of age. For a person over age 60, the risk appears real but quite small. However it is also worth noting that their choice of control population is questionable: the controls were randomly selected from the provider's practices, instead of being patients who are on an unrelated antibiotic for a similar condition. Consequently they are comparing a group of people KNOWN to have health issue(s) (by virtue of being on an antibiotic) to a group of other people--MANY of whom may have been healthy. Note also that few details are provided on the mechanism of rupture, and that they do not specify statistics regarding the variables going into the "adjusted relative risk" category. All they did was query a database and look for associations (which certainly can give good information). The entire study is just two pages long! For these reasons this study is not necessarily "well done" as you stated. These may be some of the reasons that the provider information has not been modified on the basis of this single database query & statistical analysis. And while the drug companies comprise the most profitable industry in America, they are heavily regulated by the government. In any case it seems like climbers should be aware of these issues. The important thing in my opinion is to keep any such risk in perspective, and look to data for information rather than going with isolated case reports or rumors.

I was there on Sunday too, I think we saw you near the right side of the Kingpins area. I even recall overhearing the 'pigeon poop' experience you mentioned above!! It was nice to actually climb in the sun after lurking in the gym the last couple weeks. The fog had me worried initially but the weather ended up being hard to beat!

Of course a law firm is going to run with any minimal evidence supporting a potential lawsuit!... Before believing someone who has millions of dollars to score when they say that "dangerous" combinations are causing "severe" injury it may be a good idea to look for independent data, and check out the FDA's prescribing info: FDA info This document only mentions NSAID's once: "In mice, concomitant administration of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs such as phenylbutazone and indomethacin with quinolones has been reported to enhance the CNS stimulatory effect of quinolones." I did not see NSAID's contraindicated anywhere in the document. Tendon rupture is mentioned as a potential, rare side-effect. Every drug has lots of potential, rare side effects. Some other rare, partially unsubstantiated side effects of Cipro include agitation, agranulocytosis, albuminuria, anaphylactic reactions, anosmia, candiduria, cholesterol elevation (serum), confusion, constipation, delirium, dyspepsia, dysphagia, erythema multiforme, exfoliative dermatitis, flatulence, glucose elevation (blood), hemolytic anemia, hepatic necrosis, hypotension (postural), jaundice, methemoglobinemia, myalgia, myasthenia gravis (possible exacerbation), myoclonus, nystagmus, pancreatitis, phenytoin alteration (serum), potassium elevation (serum), prothrombin time prolongation, pseudomembranous colitis (The onset of pseudomembranous colitis symptoms may occur during or after antimicrobial treatment.), psychosis (toxic), renal calculi, Stevens-Johnson syndrome, taste loss, tendinitis, tendon rupture, toxic epidermal necrolysis, triglyceride elevation (serum), vaginal candidiasis, and vasculitis. There are also 50-75 “common” side effects listed. If you expect your physician to know all of this offhand, you have some pretty high expectations of others. And if you experience one of these many symptoms in conjunction with weak data or meaningless “case reports” you have the potential to sue your doctor and make a bunch of money! Plus if one of the common side effects is experienced, eg nausea (5.2%), diarrhea (2.3%), vomiting (2.0%), abdominal pain/discomfort (1.7%), headache (1.2%), restlessness (1.1%), or rash (1.1%), it would be pretty difficult to know that the drug is causing it. I bet a lot of people have had a headache recently, even without taking Cipro! Should a patient with a “potential” drug interaction be switched to a less effective medication if that may increase the risk of serious complications from an infection? This is not a straightforward issue.

For a super cheap ski trip, you can always camp in Squamish. The Chief campground is free in the winter!

and to be complete it is worth mentioning that this crux section formerly had TWO fixed pins, the second being about a body length above the one under discussion. Both are on the topo, both were there a few months ago, both are super handy for free climbing...and both are now missing.

You may have been climbing a variation. If you go straight up, instead of cutting right to the Saggitarius anchor, you will find incredibly bomber hand & finger-sized gear placements. This section goes up to a right-facing corner, not left-facing as you specified. It's route #128 in this topo The p where it says '5.11d' is the two equalized fixed pitons. The p higher up where it says '5.10' is the fixed piton which is now missing. It looks like it is possible to continue up a left-facing corner from the Sag anchor, maybe that is the way you went? Here is a photo of the exact spot where the fixed pin used to be (immediately above the climber's helmet). You can see the hand-crack size section of the crack immediately below (next to the yellow etrier). The red sling a ways down is on the two equalized fixed pins. I can't imagine someone taking a ground fall from here as the pro below is excellent (and the fall is extremely clean too).

I agree, although I also need to admit that those pins are not necessary for freeing the route. Having fixed pins at both cruxes essentially turns Iron Horse into a sport climb. Personally I don't have a problem with this! But does anyone know when the pins were originally placed, and by whom...(first ascensionist?) I've always wondered how this sort of situation works out ethically. ps. Speaking of annoying missing fixed gear, last I saw Sloe Children was missing the fixed pin off the belay--and this part CANNOT be protected otherwise (ledge fall!) which makes it a bit scary.

From HB 1195: It seems strange that a landowner apparently WOULD be held liable for injuries if the landowner placed the fixed protection him/herself. Does this mean, in general, that the person placing any bolt or anchor could get sued??

Also as of december, the pin at the upper free crux is gone. It was there a few months ago though! (ie after the crack ends, jogs right, and continues again, there is a roof on the left which continues as a right-facing corner which formerly had a fixed pin at its base). Aiding this section is not difficult, but it would now be fairly strenuous to free climb if you want to protect this part since the stance isn't great. The section where the crack ends, jogs right, and continues could be considered a C2 move if you're short, as this would likely require a hook move off a sloping knob. Of course I'm 6'3", so I can just reach through the blank section!