scott_harpell

sick kats...

Early season ascent on Cadaver Gap. We did one long push up to the notch past Muir and we were about to toss on the G-tex cause it was getting FRIDGID(especially with the intense wind) and I look and my partner disapears! By the time I noticed this, his weight (220LB guy plus winter pack) spun me around and I was swinging tools desperately as I was being dragged in. Finally, one stuck and I anchored him off. Now the fun begins. I go to the lip and see if he is ok and he is. The crevasse is overhanging and the rope is stuck 12 inches into the lip of the crevasse so he can't prussik out. SHIT! So I prepared the lip and set up a Z-pulley... Nothin' add a C... Nada. The rope is about to break (7.9mm) so I back off. Ended up having to solo down cadaver gap in the night to get another rope/help. Lets just say downclimbing ice in the dark is not easy. There was an 80* section (very short, but still) that I almost pinched one out on. Finally I got back to the hut and got some help. Ordeal wasn't done till about 3 AM. Long ass day!!! A bit stressfull too!

and I am sure the mining companies are lobying for it to stay that way.

As for the rights to the oil, I doubt it. Here in Canada, a couple here is getting their land excavated for... get this... kitty litter... their entire property will be ripped up to make kitty litter. A mining company bought the mining rights and they are going to mine the hell out of their property. what the hell?

but this is not true. The accountability come's from one's heart and one's respect for God. Where an agnostic might cite Lock saying that we comprimise for security, The Christian is to do good to honor God. This is FAR from the mainstream logic I know. You are expecting that we must get something tangible in return for our good deeds. That is what makes it so hard. Salvation is yours if you want it, but righteousness is something that must come out of a desire to please God and seek to avopid dishonoring him.

This certainly seems to imply that the work done for the Kingdom is to be done here on earth. here is another

Christ did call the sinners to repentance, but it is not a prerequisite for salvation. As for the scripture you quoted. There are two meanings for the Kingdom of God. One is the traditional sense: in heaven. The other is in the hearts of his people. Therefore, if you have your hearts filled with these sins and are consumed by them, Christ cannot reside in your heart.

Your theology is not Christian. It is more closely aligned to Mormonism. This is what Jesus did with sinners. But hey we are all sinners. Paul, I suggest you re-read my posts on a faith-based salvation.

I don't think the majority would rationalize it, nor do I. I feel bad about the things I do wrong and the hurt I do to God, but my salvation is secure. That is why they play amazing grace so damn much; because it really does put it all in perspective. We are wretches, but we are saved through grace, not works.

That is exactly correct. As for transgressions, we are too attempt to refrain from actions which may hurt the heart of God. Things which displeases him. THey are not required for salvation, that is a gift. Someone who beleives that God has saved him should love God and feel bad when they do something that displeases him. So, yes fornication is wrong, but no, you will not have your 'pass' revoked so-to-speak.

As for a code of conduct, I would reccomend the teachings of Jesus. They are what I try to base my entire philosophy on. Granted it is necessary to understand the workings of the Jewish tradition as well considering that many of Jesus' speaches were directed to Jews and carried a Jewish context. As far as being less first century, I am not sure what you are addressing specifically, but the major difference I see in myself is that I have no problem being with non-Christians; In fact, I prefer it. If you are adressing my slvation ethic, I assure you 90% of it is based on Jesus' sayings and the rest based on my interpretation. ...Some of the most important quotes per salvation.

O.K. My take on this (granted it is not orthodoxy, but what is?) is that you are not saved through works, but through faith alone. This is the only religion where this is true. Works are meant to glorify God and to help reach a sense of enlightenment through simplification of one's life. I feel that living my life with my friends (whomever they may be) is the only way to fly. Christ dined with sinners, talked with prostitutes and embraced tax collectors, women, children and anyone else who would listen. That is my thing. It is not about actions so much as what is going on in one's heart. Some people find drinking evil. Mabe for them it has that effect, but I find that it is a great way to loosen up and let people see who you really are without the glimmering facade. Really, I feel that the greatest way for people to understand your position is through your actions. I am not stating that I am any better than anyone else, but I feel that in my heart, I try to be like Christ who I model my life after. God cares not whether you suceed in being a holy man... In fact, he states very plainly that it is impossible for us. What he does care about is that we try and believe that no matter how bad our transgressions, the birth and death of Christ pays pennance for all. Again, it is a very different theology where works are independant of one's salvation and that is one of the reasons that I am attracted to it.

They do if you understand them Paul. You see, Jesus ushered in a new 'kingdom' on earth. Before, salvation was open only to the Jews through living a pure life by eating kosher, observing the sabbath (extremely ridgidly) and adherance to the other aspects of Judaism. The comming of Christ opened up the "kingdom" up to all who were willing. As Christ said "He who has ears let him hear. Look at the parable of the good samaritan to learn more. This story is more than a story about helping a neighbor, but instructs the Jews that the letter of the law is not as important than the inherent meaning. It was better to be unclean by helping a gentile than to let him suffer and possibly die but observing his Jewish duty by walking on the other side of the street. Another example of this is the woman who touched Jesus. She had perpetual menstruation and these women were not to leave their homes for fear they would make men unclean. This woman touched Jesus and all were amazed as this Jewish man was now unclean. Did Jesus berrate her for her taboo action? No, he commended her on her faith. This demonstrates the ushering to earth of God's kingdom so it can reside in his people's hearts rather than in a temple accesible by a chosen few.

Check out Jesus' sayings on the sabbath. Again. It would help if you knew the theories you were trying to discredit. try Matthew chapter 12. Oh and you forgot the verse that is right after the one you quoted. It implies that being cut-off from one's people means death. Also, the commign of Jesus represents a shift in the mentality of the dogma of the Old Testament where Jesus is to free Christians from their sins and many old testament transgressions by taking them upon himself. Also note that Jesus ate with tax collectors. This implies that he ate unclean food or non- kosher if you will. See Luke 5:29 Where Jesus ate with Levi, a un-clean man. He goes on to say that the "healthy do not need a doctor, but the sick" implying that God's kingdom was now open not only to the Jews, but all who were willing to accept him.

Taxation without representation for athiests!

poverty

Werd check out some of the other statistics tho.

I was in the room where he died. Sad sad place.

That is how the Italians do it. The richest man in the country is their president and he has been arrested 8 times in 8 years (quite the record). Each time he is arrested he changes the law retroactively. Oh yeah and he owns the vast majority of the nation' newspapers.

Bach: Harpischord Contertos Oh and Paul. I am sorry if you think I was condescending about your Mariah Carey CD's...no really guy... you'da man!

Plaigerizing from Mein Kampf again?

No Music from after 1925 for one week. Who is with me?

That's the point for you - it's what you've chosen. Like most zealots, you fail to comprehend that others have a different view, different needs, and different capabilities. Many find the impossible to daunting to comprehend, and instead focus on the immediate. I dont fail to comprehend this, I just know that the faith laid out by Christ is radically different from the one practiced today. Just because I choose to align myself with soemthing doesn't mean I am encroaching on someone else. Have I ever on this board or while climbing with any of you imposed my faith position? Even in this thread have I? No. I have climbed with probably 50 people from this board and still have never said anything to this effect. Dru I hear you. I can't stand those people at my school and I wish I could try the same experiment as you with out getting tossed out.

I'm so glad the world has you to look after it Scott The comfort it brings to people in need, both inherently, and from the community the devoted tend to develop, is one of the few positive aspects I can think of in organized religions. I somehow think you're searching for a much deeper religion than much of the world is capable of grasping - and a majority of Christians have ever been able to comprehend. The problem with that being? Isn't that the whole point; to embrace something you cannot fully understand? I think that is marvellous.

I am glad you qualified that statement, because I defy you to find one instance where Christianity breaks down. But Oh! it fails to explain 'certain things.' What system pray-tell does not? Scott_H, I just spent a long time reading this whole thing, and I think you might be hurting what you are trying to defend, your not helping others that may agree with you . But debating religion has been around as long as the mountians. You either believe or you don't, and you can't change peoples minds -thats what it comes down to. jh I am not trying to change minds, I am jus clearing up the fallacious statements about the faith. As for hurting a position, i dont really care. I am expressing my thoughts and if it encroaches on another's so be it.