bacon art

[ivan]

relic of the 2nd anchor on dirty double overhang, removed in current shape

my jack'o'lantern model for this year

[denalidave]

Must have been tough to get such a bomb piece out, eh?

[JosephH]

Yeah, essentially the same condition the Fear of Flying pins were in. KBs overall just don't last out there, where as the Bugaboos do. You also have remember pins need periodic maintenance checks every five years or so no differently than bolts. Here's the upper FoF pin contrasted with a good KB:

 

[Farrgo]

Did Stone Rodeo get checked our recently?

[stevetimetravlr]

The pins that are in Fear of Flying look like they have been in there quite a while at least as of 2 weeks ago. Joe, are you saying that you replaced them recently? or within a couple years?

[LostCamKenny]

KBs overall just don't last out there, where as the Bugaboos do.

... especially when they are nailed in vertically oriented cracks.

[JosephH]

The pins that are in Fear of Flying look like they have been in there quite a while at least as of 2 weeks ago. Joe, are you saying that you replaced them recently? or within a couple years?

They were replaced in 2007. Note that the part of the bad pins from both DDO and FoF that was visible looked fine, but it only took a slight tap of the hammer to hear that they were bad and a breath of a funk to remove either. The outwardly 'good' appearance a pin can exhibit to the eye is no different than that of a bolt which looks good but in reality has been rotting away back in the hole. At least with pins you can test them and get some idea of how sound they are. After what I've seen at Beacon with bolts I'd say you should definitely be using SS in the Gorge and surrounds on up to around Mt Hood otherwise some percentage of them will just end up time bombs with a 10-15 year lifespan yet still look good to the eye.

[JosephH]

Did Stone Rodeo get checked our recently?

Stone Rodeo is one of the last on the list and I stopped to look at it again today. The two pins high on it are likely not good at this point and Vern, who did it last, also didn't think they'd hold. It's a bit of a special case, as setting up on it with a load is a bit of a hassle, but I'll be trying to get it done in the next week or two.

[kevbone]

How do you know that Vern did it last? Have you been out there every day?

[JosephH]

Did I miss your recent send of it?

[kevbone]

Did I miss your recent send of it?

 

I saw a guy on it two weeks ago on a Sunday. You must have missed it.

[ivan]

how'd he do? see if he topped out or whipped on the pins? i'd dig on watching someone send it and imagine the hard men who've put up those routes by the trail would do just fine on it...

[denalidave]

Did I miss your recent send of it?

 

I saw a guy on it two weeks ago on a Sunday. You must have missed it.

Was it Fargo? I think he could have sent it last year if only he had a better belayer...

[JosephH]

Pretty much just the two Nates are the only ones I know of nosing around it since Vern did it. I haven't been on it in a long time, but will be going up and sorting out the two pins this weekend if we get a weather break.

[kevbone]

I wanted to "retro" bolt, not rebolt this, about 5 or 6 years ago. The route has gone to waste due to a poor job in the first place. It is such a striking line and it never gets done because of poor pro and bolt/pin placements. So I asked Bob (in person, he did the FA) if he minded if I fix it so your average 5.12a climber would not be so scared to get on it. He told me (right in front of Jim) to go ahead and add as many bolts as I see fit. Then I had kids and kind of retired from putting routes up. I do want to get back to it someday.

[JosephH]

It's already been retrobolted once from when it was put up. As for the FA, if the book is correct on the date, then my old partner Tangen-Foster did the FFA (onsight) before Bob with me seconding. It was his first day at Beacon and that is as far down the trail as he got. I recall at the time thinking it was pretty sketch as it didn't have the current retrobolts on it.

 

It already has more than enough good bolts on it as is to get you up high enough to where you won't deck no matter what, it doesn't need any more bolts below the current top bolt. I'll have to look at the pins and available placements for good pins before I'd decide to retro them with bolts.

[kevbone]

It's already been retrobolted once from when it was put up. As for the FA, if the book is correct on the date, then my old partner Tangen-Foster did the FFA (onsight) before Bob with me seconding. It was his first day at Beacon and that is as far down the trail as he got. I recall at the time thinking it was pretty sketch as it didn't have the current retrobolts on it.

 

It already has more than enough good bolts on it as is to get you up high enough to where you won't deck no matter what. I'll have to look at the pins and available placements for good pins before I'd decide to retro them with bolts.

 

 

So your friend climbed it totally on gear?

[JosephH]

When we got on it we coincidentally and without realizing it had squeaked in after Bob had aided it, but before they freed it. There was a fixed wire and a couple of 1/4" bolts if I recall correctly, so it was a mixed line even then. But Foster did rings in college, was / is fearless to a fault, soloed a few 12s, and we lived for doing roofs so it wasn't much of a stretch for him. I was actually sketching on it way more following than he did on lead.

 

Edit: It would have been on my old rack that was later stolen so it would have been on nuts and original Friends of which I had a double sets. As I recall I freed up to the base of Silver Crow going out left from the Pipeline anchor after we finished Stone Rodeo. It was a good day and we hadn't seen each other in quite awhile.

[kevbone]

So you accidently stole the FAA. I still think Bob has the authority to say yeah or ney to adding bolts since he bolted and cleaned it.

[JosephH]

No one 'stole' anything, we walked down the trail and did the first interesting thing we saw. I didn't put two and two together until years later. As the route has been bolted and retrobolted I'm not sure what the point of 'authority' is, but again it doesn't require any more bolts given it was done originally with about half the bolts that are there now. It was and is a bold lead that's already been dimmed down once, no need to pussify it, just need to fix the two bad high angles.

[stevetimetravlr]

Hey, I did the route back in the day, maybe I'm the first ascentionist!?

Joe, your equation is 2 + 2 = #1 , what the?

Is pussify even a word?

...

Edited September 16, 2010 by stevetimetravlr

[eldiente]

I read about it online, I'm claiming the FA on this one.

 

 

[JosephH]

Well, I suppose that would depend on when you did it, wouldn't it. Let me guess, you need more bolts on it too.

[JosephH]

Is pussify even a word?

...

I don't think so, I'm pretty sure it's just a hunger, like cheetos.

 

I'm guessing it was Farrgo who Kevin saw, but let's ask - Eldiente and Farrgo, have you guys done a spin on it yet?

[kevbone]

No one 'stole' anything, we walked down the trail and did the first interesting thing we saw. I didn't put two and two together until years later. As the route has been bolted and retrobolted I'm not sure what the point of 'authority' is, but again it doesn't require any more bolts given it was done originally with about half the bolts that are there now. It was and is a bold lead that's already been dimmed down once, no need to pussify it, just need to fix the two bad high angles.

 

I disagree on the authority. It is almost a universal rule to ask the FAA/FA/route establisher permission to touch there route. I asked Bob Mcgowen if I could fix Stone Rodeo, since he first bolted and climbed it. He said no problem and there were witnesses. It does need fixing. If it were rebolted, and the pins removed then maybe more folks would get on it. As it stands now...it is a total waste of rock IMO.