Beacon

[JosephH]

you do know i was kidding...right?

 

You? A kidder? It can't be...

 

Big Wall Tips & Tricks with Mark Hudon

 

It should also be noted that Mark and Max were one of the earliest driving forces for free climbing on El Cap which has made his recent aid renaissance all the more interesting. All his posts on prepping for that first aid climb in decades and the resulting TR are still up on supertopo and make an interesting read as well. Tons of 'how to' stuff. He also has more of them on MP. Worth going through his old posts on both if you're interested in aid as he goes into some pretty significant detail in those old posts.

[pink]

[pink]

[JosephH]

P.S. that's a hell of an anchor in that promo photo for Mark's talk.

[pink]

you do know i was kidding...right?

 

You? A kidder? It can't be...

 

Big Wall Tips & Tricks with Mark Hudon

 

It should also be noted that Mark and Max were one of the earliest driving forces for free climbing on El Cap which has made his recent aid renaissance all the more interesting. All his posts on prepping for that first aid climb in decades and the resulting TR are still up on supertopo and make an interesting read as well. Tons of 'how to' stuff. He also has more of them on MP. Worth going through his old posts on both if you're interested in aid as he goes into some pretty significant detail in those old posts.

 

 

yeah go through Marks old post and save urself $45 bucks

 

 

 

[pink]

P.S. that's a hell of an anchor in that promo photo for Mark's talk.

 

No doubt, i can hear Obi-wan right now "that's no moon, it's an anchor"

[ivan]

Offhand, I would guess that's the 'reasonable concern' that's driving the current closure - that, one way or another,

someone will try to come down the tourist trail

by this logic, they should have been doing this for the past 15 years though - if there's been any trouble over the years w/ folks on the hiking trail during a closure it's not been climbers, but tourists who figured out how easy it is to pass the gate

[JosephH]

Offhand, I would guess that's the 'reasonable concern' that's driving the current closure - that, one way or another,

someone will try to come down the tourist trail

by this logic, they should have been doing this for the past 15 years though - if there's been any trouble over the years w/ folks

on the hiking trail during a closure it's not been climbers, but tourists who figured out how easy it is to pass the gate

 

Aside from the fact that statement isn't true, lets not get carried away as this isn't a generalized case, rather it's strictly about

people on the trail while it's hammered and obstructed with guard rails down and them trying to sort it out and

work to get it back open.

 

 

I get it you're being deprived your romp, but seriously, I mean if you can't get their perspective after seeing that picture then

I honestly don't know what to say other than there is essentially no situation or circumstance where you'll acknowledge

they may feel they have a valid reason for your being denied.

[pink]

that's quite the rockfall... i thought i felt a disturbance in the force

[ivan]

again joe, i don't think we're that far away in perspective or temperament - that pic shows clearly why the hiking trail is closed and looks just the same as many other pics that could have been taken over the past 15 years - the most recent severe closure i recall closed down the hiking trail for 3 months or so (and was accompanied w/ no climber trail closure - are you saying you're fine w/ that if there's in fact no huge rock-pile waiting to spill death down the south side?)

[ivan]

i'm also not speaking as some-one dying to get out the door - i've got t-giving the next couple of days w/ the family and planning on climbing something a wee bit bigger on sunday - still, shit, barring unbelievable carnage and imminent public danger on the south side, it's bad policy going forward to say a closure on the public trail should always include a blanket closure on the climber's side. how on earth can you be okay w/ that given past history?

[pink]

again joe, i don't think we're that far away in perspective or temperament - that pic shows clearly why the hiking trail is closed and looks just the same as many other pics that could have been taken over the past 15 years - the most recent severe closure i recall closed down the hiking trail for 3 months or so (and was accompanied w/ no climber trail closure - are you saying you're fine w/ that if there's in fact no huge rock-pile waiting to spill death down the south side?)

 

 

there is always death trying to spill down on you... that's the best part

 

 

it's funny how no one argues with Joseph anymore...

[JosephH]

still, shit, barring unbelievable carnage and imminent public danger on the south side, it's bad policy going forward

to say a closure on the public trail should always include a blanket closure on the climber's side. how on earth can you

be okay w/ that given past history?

 

I didn't say I was ok with it; I said I can understand where they might be coming from and the concerns which are

likely driving the decision. Big difference.

 

Also, the past (and present) history of climbers and the closure you mention likely plays into the decision - i.e. if they can't

trust climbers to respect the closure under normal circumstances, exactly what alternatives do you think they feel

they have under extenuating ones?

 

Wanna change things? Well, you can't dictate change and there's no effective external leverage so, if you're serious, then

there's just no avoiding having a relationship with the folks who can make shit happen. Otherwise, you're just another pain

point to be managed instead of a resource that can be reached out to when shit comes up. And if folks aren't

interested in that it's cool, but then bitching about shit here, while satisfying, is about as useful as head-banging

the base of of FFS.

 

And at this point it's on you guys one way or the other as I'm just climbing and if Bill is crazy enough to get in the middle of

it all then I'd suggest backing and trusting him.

 

there is always death trying to spill down on you... that's the best part

 

That's my favorite part as well and what I like about Beacon: it hasn't been totally pussified yet like everywhere else.

[ivan]

if Bill is crazy enough to get in the middle of

it all then I'd suggest backing and trusting him.

 

i said literally that a couple posts back

 

bill's gonna share a report here soon - he and adam got to climb the corner yday to suss out the situation - i agreed w/ everything he had to say in it's first draft

[billcoe]

"if Bill is crazy enough to get in the middle of

it all then I'd suggest backing and trusting him."

 

Haha, lord I hope not, but thank you. Happy Thanksgiving to ya all. Spend a moment being thankful and hugging some loved ones. Before I go do that, here's what I know. I'm hearing from a lot of folks, and I incorporated the best thoughts that didn't have swear words into an email to the park folks. Heath has said he welcomes calls from anyone, and he'd even take them from his cell. SO, don't call me and expect me to call him with the details you want conveyed. Call him, not me. Randy and Heath evidently did get a lot of calls on this already.

 

It was a big blow out there, fortunately no one was injured and for the most part the structures were not damaged. It's a big responsibility on the park folks to hustle folks out of the campgrounds etc etc before they were killt (Ivan word there and they should be damned proud of that cause it was a serious shit show that came down from the heavens. They are working like busy beavers and will be for some time, and could use our help. Save Dec 5th for a cleanup date, and it's park related, not climbing related as the climbers area is looking in much better shape than the park. The wind hit from the west, and the south side was somewhat sheltered from all appearances.

 

As far as good news. I only have a bit. ...hang on someones waking up I'm gonna go give someone a hug and get some coffee...be right back.

 

OK, start from scratch. Parts of this I forwarded to the Parks folks. After the big storm I contacted Heath Yates, Beacons park manager, and I offered to help if he needed me. Adam had done the the same thing. Turned out, he did. Heath felt that the 2 big issues he had remaining as it related to climbers were safety related. I'm paraphrasing but the 1st was potential loose blocks or uprooted trees and any additional danger to climbers. He asked us to examine and report on that issue. Despite recent rains we were able to climb the s side to the Jills thrill anchors. It looks much better than either Adam or I thought based on the detritus on the ground. There was all kind of blowdown, tree branches and rocks littering the base of the south side. We tossed anything that looked like it needed it and we agreed that there are no lethal issues with the south side climbing area that we saw. So we're done with good news now.

 

The 2nd issue Heath had and where we are now was the reduced potential for a rescue should one be needed. (ie, Skamania Search And Rescue (SAR) not able to access the top to let a rope down). He has contacted them and is waiting for their reply. If they say, "we can climb up and effect a rescue in an emergency", I suspect that folks will be climbing shortly afterwards although I won't and can't speak for them. That is where it is right now.

 

Sending me an email every 5 min with the subject line "Is it open now" Is it open now" "how bout now?" won't do shit. It's in Skamania SARs inbox.

 

I've heard from many folks already just since yesterday and they all have the same question/statement which I forwarded to the Parks staff: "We've never had a climbing closure when the trail was closed, why now?"

 

It made me reflect to when I first climbed at Beacon. There were no cell phones and we never saw the ranger, regardless, he had his hands full with other things. There were no rescues, or ability for such. It was one of the things which made the climbing so good, because that's the way most other climbing areas in the backcountry still are. Anybody climbing in the North Cascades Park or the Wallows is much further from a rescue than at Beacon, and there is no cell coverage. As climbers it is what we expect. I'd suggested to the park folks that there may be 2 ways to keep the park open for climbers.

 

1st) Start a phone tree of climbers who live close, say North Bonneville or White salmon (Kenny and Dave come to mind). They could be called and be theoretically on the rock climbing with in a short time to bring food, water, headlamps etc to anyone in need. It was a recent incident of unprepared noobies that has this issue on the park people minds. Ask Kenny the details of that. They could also fix a rope from above for the Skamania SAR folks, climbing ropes is one of the skills that they have and practice even if they are not technical rock climbers.

 

 

This is what I pitched to the parks:

2nd) THE CRUX OF IT. If having the ability to effect a rescue is a total red line for you folks AND Skamania (SAR) can ONLY do top down AND there is absolutely no way to access to top (although it appears that one of the photos Randy sent along someone hiked up there to the height SAR would want to drop in at and took the picture, could not SAR, with ropes and gear to protect themselves also go there?), if it's necessary I'd suggest we contact Portland Mountain Rescue. They have many climbers as part of the group, practice technical rescues, and co-ordinate with the PJs (Pararescue Jumper) of the 304th rescue squadron. They love to practice such things and are usually present with at least 1 sometimes 2 Helicopters for Mt Hood rescues. One of my neighbors is a PJ officer, I could ask what the protocol is.

 

So, it's in SARS lap. If anyone knows any SAR members, now would be the time to call them. As far as that goes, we fix lines and leave them all winter at various places (Ivan has 4 out now that I'm aware of). Why not pre-fix a line out at Beacon if that would work for SAR?

 

 

 

Edited November 26, 2015 by billcoe

[stevetimetravlr]

Why not start our own SAR group out of local Beacon climbers?

[ivan]

arguably the best sar in the world is in yosemite, yet they don't ban climbing when conditions are too poor for sar to respond

 

beacon climbers should have no expectation of sar bailing them out (nor have they, historically) - it's nice there's a local sar that's willing to help when it can, but it's unwillingness to be around on any given day shouldn't give them the right to close climbing on those days - at any rate, based on the pictures, the hiking trail looks completely accessible to a sar team - the park closes the hiking trail as soon as it becomes untenable for old ladies w/ walkers - that's fine, i get the reason, but a closure for old ladies shouldn't apply for competent, well-equipped rescue personnel

 

so, am i reading you right bill? heath ain't opening the park for climbing until sar gives a thumb's up? if so, can you provide contact info to get all the folks emailing you to shift their earnest energy to them?

[billcoe]

 

 

Hi Ivan, I don't have the SAR info. However, this was the last email I received from Randy Klein yesterday.

 

Greetings All,

 

Based on today’s reconnaissance, which included Adam and Bill climbing about half-way up the south face (I’m not sure which route they took), we are continuing to keep the south face closed to climbing temporarily while we consult with emergency rescue providers regarding their ability and comfort level conducting a rescues from the base of the wall. As you know rescues are typically conducted by accessing the top via the hiking trail and rappelling down. We hope to have conversations with the emergency service providers next week and will keep you appraised. Also occurring in the background is consideration of the quickest way to get the hiking trail operational which could include accessing Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) funding. Please disseminate this information as you see fit – we will keep you appraised as we receive new information . . . Best wishes, Randy

 

 

 

Randy Kline, Parks Planner

Washington State Parks and Recreation Commission

1111 Israel Road SW, Tumwater, WA 98501

PO Box 42650, Olympia, WA 98504

Phone: 360.902.8632

randy.kline@parks.wa.gov

www.parks.state.wa.us

 

Randy wanted the info to be released out there and Adam had an excellent response, snippet here "...I'm going to advocate for the climbers that we have access to the South Face. "One idea: Can we work out some sort of "sign-in" process? Something where climbers simply check-in with the Rangers. That way we can make sure that nobody is going out climbing without knowledge of how to safely rappel. I for one have never climbed at Beacon without knowing that I could get down safely if injured or if my partner is injured...."

 

[JosephH]

Ivan, I'm with you relative to closing the South Face just because SAR doesn't have access. Partly in principle and partly

because I don't at the moment have a ton of faith in the local SARs ability to operate safely at Beacon. But, again, all the

more reason to be actively engaged with the WSP in an on-going working relationship to help inform their policies, views,

and personal opinions / biases.

 

Why not start our own SAR group out of local Beacon climbers?

 

Steve, that's a laudable idea, but there's way, way more to it than one might imagine. It would require a good working

relationship with the WSP, sheriff, and fire dept. and it would take a ton of time [away from climbing] just to get certified

in that fairly insular world. I think locals acting as vertical adjuncts / guides would probably make more sense, but

even that would require establishing a formal and trusted working relationship with the SAR group.

 

And upfront here let me say I've been involved with a few rescues and encountered quite a few local SARs around

the country over the decades, including multiple encounters with Rocky Mountain Rescue, and those experiences

have almost uniformly left me with a less-than-positive impression of them on the whole relative to vertical work

(YOSAR, being climber-involved, is an exception to that). My main complaint being vertical SAR rescues typically

involve an inordinate number of very unqualified people who have no business being there when a half-dozen well-qualified

people would more than suffice to get the job done and limit the potential for further accidents. But unfortunately the SAR

flash mob thing is an endemic aspect of their volunteer / social culture.

 

And the whole SAR deal at Beacon is complicated. When Erik was here I reached out to those guys in an attempt to assess

their vertical capabilities at Beacon (as opposed to say a Hamilton rescue) and to propose taking one or two of them

on a tour of the available down-routes and anchors which could be useful in a rescue. I met with them briefly once, but that

was as far as it went. Again, it's a fairly insular group who pride themselves on their professionalism and skills and my

[repeated] impression is they are seldom amenable to outside help or suggestion (however much in need of it they

may actually be).

 

I reached out because Beacon represents some special challenges in this regard. For instance, one of us getting from

the tourist trail to rap points may seem trivial, but it's not, and especially so for people unfamiliar with the various

down-routes / ledge systems and attempting to bring down a lot of gear and a litter. Doubly so if it were dark

and / or any weather set in. All in all, Beacon is a dangerous place for the uninitiated to be wandering about up on

the ledges attempting to figure out how to get to a victim and I include SAR in that statement.

 

Another issue is, in a typical SAR response at a place like Beacon, some folks would go in from the top and a raft of other

people would take the trail to the base until they were under the accident scene. That's highly problematic at Beacon because

of the high potential for the upper SAR crew to end up dislodging rocks onto those below ( and this is also one of the reasons

I've always advocated a pre-open survey and cleaning of as much loose rock as possible).

 

Those are just a couple of several problematic issues with SAR conducting vertical operations at Beacon, but to address

any of them locals would have to be formally organized, establish honest, trusted working relationships with multiple

agencies which would take years to develop at this point even if folks didn't have serious problems with 'the man'.

[pink]

[JosephH]

Ever helpful. But then that's already the default.

[billcoe]

LIMITED OPEN ANNOUNCED. REMEMBER THAT THE DESCENT TRAIL IS CLOSED, YOU MUST RAPPEL TO THE BASE AND HIKE OUT THE CLIMBERS TRAIL, YOU CANNOT TOP OUT. Please reference the above photos. There will be work occurring above and that stuff is going to slopping over the edges. This is the latest from Randy Klein.

 

"Hi All,

 

Thank you for your patience and the information you provided related to emergency services. Over the last couple of days we had a chance to speak with emergency service providers and they indicated that they are comfortable with a bottom-up rescue scenario. Based on this fact Beacon Rock will be open for climbing beginning on Thursday December 3rd - however climbing, at this time, will be restricted to portions of the south face. Please note the following:

 

The south face will be open for climbing from the SE Face Route Young Warriors west to Ground Zero. This limited opening is based on the potential for rock and tree fall in the vicinity of the hiking trail. Please note that climbers will need to rappel down since the hiking trail will be inaccessible. As clean-up and assessment continue, we are working towards opening the entire south face as soon as possible.

 

The west and northwest sections of Beacon Rock continue to be closed due to risk associated with rock and tree fall.

 

Many of you are aware that we received a number of emails and park phone calls related to the temporary closure. Frustration by climbers who are not receiving current information is to be expected and your help minimizing this frustration is much appreciated. I will include a discussion item on our December 9th meeting agenda so we can debrief this situation and determine if there are ways we can better address similar temporary closures in the future . . . Best wishes, Randy"

 

Thanks

 

 

I had received several pictures and the trail took multiple hits and looks like it needs a lot of work. The park wants it closed and us off of it till they can get it fixed and finished. The limited climbing opening is contingent on us staying off the trail and away from the fall zone underneath.

[billcoe]

Sorry for the late notice on this. There will be a Beacon Rock work party/cleanup this Saturday, Dec. 5th. Come one come all if you are available and wish to volunteer to clean up the windstorm mess.

 

"plan on 9:00 we can meet at the pole shelter directly across from the park office. We will have all of the tools and gear needed. If folks can bring gloves that would be great. We have extras if folks forget a pair."

[JosephH]

Bill, great job. Thanks for putting in the time and energy.

[pink]

Bill, great job. Thanks for putting in the time and energy.

 

 

Yeah, Thanks Bill :kisss: