Ron Paul

[JayB]

A)I agree with much of libertarianism's view of the state; my problem with it is its fetishism of private property, its lack of a critique of capital, and its inability to grapple with the relation between private wealth and public power.

 

So you agree with libertarianism's view of the state...but what you take exception to are the restraints which private property and economic freedom impose on the power of the state.

 

"I'm all for chastity, it's just the abstinence that I take issue with."

 

 

 

 

[prole]

You present a false duality based on an inaccurate separation of the economic from the political. One of the primary functions of the state in capitalist society is to protect and enhance private property. Libertarianism's inability to grasp this simple truism and that state structures are formed and informed by class relations are exactly what I take issue with.

[Blake]

Ron Paul is rad. Young people like him because he is honest and says things regardless of how well they would play in focus groups. He isn't trying to pander to everyone. I think if all politicians spoke with the same honest, respectful, no BS tone, our system would be better off.

 

What are your reactions to this?

 

w3iKkt9WS5s

 

[G-spotter]

Let's say you are on the gold standard, and there's 1 million total tons of gold in the world.

 

If you find an ore deposit that can be refined into another million tons of gold, what happens to the value of your currency?

[prole]

Let's say you are on the gold standard, and there's 1 million total tons of gold in the world.

 

If you find an ore deposit that can be refined into another million tons of gold, what happens to the value of your currency?

 

I think this one has already been covered by Auric Goldfinger.

[JayB]

You present a false duality based on an inaccurate separation of the economic from the political. One of the primary functions of the state in capitalist society is to protect and enhance private property. Libertarianism's inability to grasp this simple truism and that state structures are formed and informed by class relations are exactly what I take issue with.

 

Where did you get the idea that the Liberal tradition postulates a clear separation between political and economic power, between political and economic liberty, etc?

 

One of the central claims of this school of thought has always been that political and economic liberty are inseparable from one another. In your second sentence, for example, you are basically paraphrasing one of Locke's central contentions, which makes your argument that these insights of yours have hitherto escaped the attention of Libertarians and/or (classical) Liberals especially humorous.*

 

*"Government has no other end, but the preservation of property."

 

-John Locke

 

 

*"Whenever the legislators endeavour to take away, and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any farther obedience, and are left to the common refuge, which God hath provided for all men, against force and violence.

 

Whensoever therefore the legislative shall transgress this fundamental rule of society; and either by ambition, fear, folly or corruption, endeavour to grasp themselves, or put into the hands of any other, an absolute power over the lives, liberties, and estates of the people; by this breach of trust they forfeit the power the people had put into their hands for quite contrary ends, and it devolves to the people, who. have a right to resume their original liberty, and, by the establishment of a new legislative, (such as they shall think fit) provide for their own safety and security, which is the end for which they are in society."

 

-John Locke

 

[Hugh Conway]

Let's say you are on the gold standard, and there's 1 million total tons of gold in the world.

 

If you find an ore deposit that can be refined into another million tons of gold, what happens to the value of your currency?

 

I think this one has already been covered by Auric Goldfinger.

 

Spain had him beat.

[prole]

Let's say you are on the gold standard, and there's 1 million total tons of gold in the world.

 

If you find an ore deposit that can be refined into another million tons of gold, what happens to the value of your currency?

 

I think this one has already been covered by Auric Goldfinger.

 

Yeah, but... kinda like in reverse, man.