Twin ropes used as regular halves = death?

[jared_j]

Second Ascent had some 8mm x 60m Edelweiss skinny ropes marked way down this weekend that I bought, called Duolights (at the bottom of the page):

 

http://www.edelweiss-ropes.com/anglais/cordes-alpines-us.html

 

 

The label didn't have a lot of English on it, and I explicitly asked several sales associates to help me understand if these were twins or doubles. Each assured me they were doubles, and I clarified with them exactly what this meant.

 

Well, I get home, delighted with my find. I go online to find out how much they weigh per meter, and lo and behold, the website tells me they're twins, not doubles.

 

I want to try to understand the risks involved in using these as doubles (e.g. taking a fall onto only one of the ropes). The parameters from their website for using them with 'twin' technique are:

 

Diameter - 8 mm

Weight - 42 g/m

Elongation 5-80 kg - 7,6 %

Impact force - ~ 9,00 kN

Falls / Average of tests UIAA - 16

 

My physics isn't very sharp these days. Is a linear approximation (e.g. halving / doubling appropriate numbers) a reasonable approximation for thinking about the elongation and impact forces? Anyone have an idea of estimating the UIAA fall # for one of them from the twin result of 16?

 

Alternately, anyone want a pair of brand new 60m dry twins for $180?

 

Edit: Clarity.

Edited November 19, 2007 by jared_j

[TrogdortheBurninator]

i wouldnt use twins as halfs, even if simply for the psychological aspect.

 

i would hope that 2nd ascent would take them back, given that they misrepresented them to you.

[jared_j]

That would be a good approach if I hadn't already cut off the tags so that I could flake 'em / de-tangle 'em.

 

I only looked online recently because I wanted to see how their combined weight compared to my fatty single rope. If I hadn't have done that, I would not have known. There was no description on the tag that I could discern that said anything like "twin". It was mostly not English.

 

Please spare me the "you're a dumb@$$" comments, as I already know. This was to be my first set of doubles, and I should have done better homework.

Edited November 19, 2007 by jared_j

[TrogdortheBurninator]

fyi, i think that ce requires that the end of the ropes be marked with the ropes usage

http://www.thebmc.co.uk/Feature.aspx?id=1440

 

 

[JosephH]

These are twins - not halfs. Wanting them to be halfs won't make them so - take them back, show them the link above, and get your money back.

[billcoe]

Sorry that I can't answer your question. Doesn't the UIAA mandate that the ends MUST be marked with a 1 (single) or a 1/2 (twin or doubles) or a 00 - (twins only)?

 

Your rope should have tape on the ends with one of those marks. I'd like to say that you should use it as directed, but we almost dropped one of the doubles on Epinephrine (so climbing with a sole 7.8mm) in Vegas last week. - being lazy and wanting light.

 

Wasn't planning on falling though.

 

Can always e-bay them, probably sell for more than you paid.

 

opps, better answers have appeared above since I started typing.

Edited November 19, 2007 by billcoe

[jared_j]

I didn't know that - I've only purchased singles before and thus didn't pay attention to what was written down there. Thanks for the tip. Weakens my case for returning 'em since I should have known that if I were in the market for doubles. Off they are to the yard sale.

[billcoe]

Surprised to see the Metolius ropes I was using are lighter than your twins, and are a double rope.

 

specs:

 

UIAA falls: twin 16, half 6

weight: 38 g/m

sheath slippage: 0

max. impact force: twin 8.5 kN, half 5.7 kN

elongation: twin 7%, half 8%

certification: UIAA, CE, EN 892

 

Good luck with it!

[TrogdortheBurninator]

I didn't know that - I've only purchased singles before and thus didn't pay attention to what was written down there. Thanks for the tip. Weakens my case for returning 'em since I should have known that if I were in the market for doubles. Off they are to the yard sale.

 

i'd disagree with that. i think you have every right to return them if the sales people told you definitively that they were half ropes. the shop has more responsibility to be properly informed than the customer. they could just as easily have looked at the rope ends, and they should know the markings are there.

[catbirdseat]

I suggest you just use the ropes as twins and call it good.

[RuMR]

Hey Jared,

 

I might be interested in taking them off your hands...how much?

[RuMR]

doh...just read carefully...180 for the pair, would you sell individually?

[jared_j]

Edited November 19, 2007 by jared_j

[jared_j]

I don't want rope proliferation in my closet; doubles offer more diversification of uses than twins relative to the single rope I already have. If it weren't for my aversion to having N! pieces of gear (and a limited budget), I'd just keep 'em.

[Hendershot]

For what it's worth, I was looking at the same rope at Second Ascent to pair with my Mammut 8 mm and the associate suggested I use it as a half rope. Seems like you weren't the only one given the same disinformation.

[jared_j]

As explained earlier, I cut the tags off already to flake, and didn't expect to be able to return 'em. After a quick conversation on the phone with a manager there, I was assured that they were gonna let me return 'em even though I cut the tags.

 

So yeah, great customer service. I originated this thread thinking I was gonna be stuck with the ropes since I clipped the tags, but they were super responsive (I got called back in like 5 minutes).

 

Thanks, Second Ascent!

Edited November 19, 2007 by jared_j