How Long should projects remain virgin?

[G-spotter]

group

[lancegranite]

I'm not too sorry, it was your actions that got you into this mess.

Maybe you should have called him and just asked, from what it sounds like, you were asked to do so several times.

 

 

[Kendra]

after 6 months of working a project it is aparent to me that if it has not gone in 6 that its not going to go. so open it up for everyone to climb. if the most important thing to you is a fa and not shareing the route with other climbers, need to re asses what is important to you.

[kevbone]

after 6 months of working a project it is aparent to me that if it has not gone in 6 that its not going to go. so open it up for everyone to climb. if the most important thing to you is a fa and not shareing the route with other climbers, need to re asses what is important to you.

 

Kendra.....he never worked the route. He got seriously injury right after he bolted it. Hence the request for it not to be climbed.

 

Here is the end. I like Ryan P…..but he stepped over the line and now is paying for it. So he got the FFA…..whoopdi do. He will for ever be known as that guy who did what EVERYBODY else did not. Ryan knew very well what he was doing would piss people off. And he did it anyway. That is the part that gets me.

[G-spotter]

What it comes down to is tha Ryan is the only one who had the ballz to do what you all wanted to but couldn't.

[TrogdortheBurninator]

Kevbone, I think Kendra was addressing the original post and not your specific isolated case.

[kevbone]

What it comes down to is tha Ryan is the only one who had the ballz to do what you all wanted to but couldn't.

 

Does is take balls to step on your friends? Kick em when there down....your way of thinking is unkind.

 

G-spotter....treat people how you would want to be treated.

[kevbone]

Kevbone, I think Kendra was addressing the original post and not your specific isolated case.

 

Thanks, but the original post is about the specific isolated case.

[TrogdortheBurninator]

But the original post was written as a general hypothetical question.

 

Other wise the title should have read

":cry: some one stole my boyfriends project, please tell me what they did was wrong:cry:"

[kevbone]

But the original post was written as a general hypothetical question.

 

Kind of....but the hypothetical question arose from a specific incident.

Edited May 21, 2007 by kevbone

[Alpinfox]

You know what I think is more selfish? Taking the bolts out of TWO lines and DESTROYING THE HOLDS!!

 

Could you elaborate on this please?

 

Are you saying someone did this?

[rob]

Come on guys, you can reach 10 pages

 

almost there....

[crimper]

g spotter is such a punk, he's even sticking up for ryan just so he can piss off the people who actually care. when you've got like 9,000 posts next to your name it's either because you have no sense of proportion and care about everything, you care about nothing and are just aggravating other people, or you are underemployed and could really use a hobby besides sounding off to strangers. so which is it?

 

when g spotter has your back, and nobody else does, it's pretty clear you're in the wrong.

 

thanks for clearing things up for us g spotter!

 

(are we at 10 pages yet?)

 

 

[G-spotter]

another ball-less wonder

[kevbone]

Hey Dru….this thread so far has remained a conversation. Let’s keep spray in spray please. Thanks.

[crimper]

hey g spotter, i was just feeling left out and wanted some of your crap spewed my way. ah, that felt good.

 

and as kevbone and i keep saying: several climbers could have led the climb at any time but didn't because they have at least a little bit of class, as well as respect for the routsetter and his work and his injury.

 

but according to your logic, it would be "ballsy" of me to punch you in the face if i met you and felt i could take you. but i wouldn't EVEN IF I COULD. i could also take candy from a cripple, but i wouldn't.

 

i guess that's the difference between you and most everybody else i know. just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. or did you miss that lesson back in grade school?

 

 

[TrogdortheBurninator]

Likely I'd feel different as a friend of the developer, but two years seems really excessive to me if the route is on public land. The whole time line seems a little vague to me as well, so maybe one of you guys can elaborate. From what I gather he spent weeks preparing the route, then had time to top rope the route, but was instantly stricken by some accident and he was unable to make even one lead attempt (if he sent it clean on top rope, why not go for lead)? How much time elapsed while he was healthy enough to attempt the route after it had been prepared? When did he expect to be healthy enough to attempt the route again (in an accident as severe as this sounds would he ever be healthy enough)?

 

If the guy chops his own route now, and particularly if he defaces the route otherwise, his ego must be infinitely larger and more fragile than the guy who nabbed the FFA.

[G-spotter]

 

and as kevbone and i keep saying: several climbers could have led the climb at any time but didn't

 

talk minus action equals zero. didn't equals couldn't.

[kevbone]

Likely I'd feel different as a friend of the developer, but two years seems really excessive to me if the route is on public land. The whole time line seems a little vague to me as well, so maybe one of you guys can elaborate. From what I gather he spent weeks preparing the route, then had time to top rope the route, but was instantly stricken by some accident and he was unable to make even one lead attempt (if he sent it clean on top rope, why not go for lead)? How much time elapsed while he was healthy enough to attempt the route after it had been prepared? When did he expect to be healthy enough to attempt the route again (in an accident as severe as this sounds would he ever be healthy enough)?

 

If the guy chops his own route now, and particularly if he defaces the route otherwise, his ego must be infinitely larger and more fragile than the guy who nabbed the FFA.

 

Ok....he bolted part of it before the accident. then his back got better and he and I bolted the rest of it and the top roped it clean same day and thought it needed alot of cleaning and was a death route as it stood. Then his back took a turn for the worse and he has never recovered.

 

The point is all the other developers and climbers who go there respected the huge red ribbon J placed there. Egoboy was asked by me in person standing under the route last summer to respect the red flag......all climbers did respected this.... except him. This is the lame part of the story.

[pink_chalk]

There are two questions, and remember not everyone can read between the lines and know that this thread originated from a specific incident.

 

1) in general, how long should a route be reserved

 

2) in this particular situation involving original route setter and his on going condition, how long should subject line remain reserved

 

General consensus says 6 months to one year/climbing season for 1 and 2. The locals with a more passionate approach agreed to close this line for an unspecified period of time allowing route setter time to heal. To me, an honorable thing to do for a friend / local climber. *But what about all the other kids? Wasn't this playground formed for others to enjoy? Didn't Jim Opedyke share with us? What original route setter failed to see is that after two years perhaps it was his time to return the favor and open the line to someone else. Most of us concur two years is too long. Time to make a bold move. Yeah it sucks that original route setter was stepped on, but its done. So lets move on to enjoying the climb and try to learn from this w/o the personal attacks.

[crimper]

g spotter, you bore me, i'm done with you.

 

pink chalk, i agree that the thing to take away from this is that 2 years is excessive, and jason probably should have opened the route after that much time elapsed. by not doing so, he created a situation where someone would almost certainly climb it against his will.

 

but instead of it being climbed by accident, or by a genuinely ignorant climber, it was climbed by ryan, who admitted he did so for selfish reasons and with full knowledge of why everyone else was showing respect.

 

so now ryan has earned a reputation as "that one selfish guy who knowingly did that off-limits route at ozone that everyone else respected." he may be a great guy, but that's how i know him now. and maybe he thought it through and realized he would get a bad rap from the locals, or maybe he didn't care - but the fact he posted on this thread indicates he does care.

 

 

[catbirdseat]

Seems like whenever conflict happens there is at least some blame on either side. In this case some stubborness on the one hand a some hubris on the other.

[rob]

"We told him not to climb it, and he didn't listen to us and that hurt our feelings"

 

Damn, I wish I was a local so I could tell you guys down there that you sound like a bunch of wankers.

[Alpinfox]

You know what I think is more selfish? Taking the bolts out of TWO lines and DESTROYING THE HOLDS!!

 

Could you elaborate on this please?

 

Are you saying someone did this?

 

I repeat my question again. Did someone smash holds on a rock climb?

 

I don't really care about this FFA bullshit (I think its a juvenile pissing contest), but if somebody smashed up a rock climb, that is extremely upsetting and I want to know about it.

[kevbone]

You know what I think is more selfish? Taking the bolts out of TWO lines and DESTROYING THE HOLDS!!

 

Could you elaborate on this please?

 

Are you saying someone did this?

 

I repeat my question again. Did someone smash holds on a rock climb?

 

I don't really care about this FFA bullshit (I think its a juvenile pissing contest), but if somebody smashed up a rock climb, that is extremely upsetting and I want to know about it.

 

Check your pms bro.