billcoe Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 I own and will continue to use their gear, but my god! You are a brave, brave man. I am shocked that anyone has any faith in any of the aliens on their rack.... seriously, if a company is sending unswaged crap out the door, in the midst of a deadly serious recall, why trust anything they've ever made? My life deserves real QC...... __________________________________________________________ Well, I think JH said it earlier. We we first started out, we climbed on plenty of crap. We would use 5mm perlon cord on nuts (tests to what? 1000 lbs new on a good day?, thread our own nuts with wire and no nicopress swedge, just epoxy to hold the ends on. Hell, I had a friend make some nuts out of a plastic frying pan handle he cut into pieces. (you know who you are don't make me out you). AND USED THEM. Well, I used them too when leading with said rack. My first carabiners tested to 1800 lbs. New. So, I'll climb with Aliens still....carefully and prudently. It is a small- tiny, in fact: percentage of their gear which is crap, and I'll try to do some testing beforehand (funking or jumping on) for what thats worth. I don't think it is a brave thing, or a stupid thing...just a thing. Show up and use Opdykes rack sometime to see what that's all about. He's got 25 year + old carabiners that would test out NEW, to 2000 lbs and slings older than you probably are. His safety margin is in his mental state and capacity. The gear is there for if and when that fails. Course, knowing this, I bring my rack, with new Wild country Heliums which test to easily double what his did, and they are new as well, etc etc. But that's me and my thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korup Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Using homemade nuts and low strength 'biners back in the day was the ONLY option: if you wanted to climb, those were the tools available. Why settle for that crap now, when there is tons of solid, safe, and dependable gear on the market? CCH is just a joke; did Yvon ever send out pins that folded when you set 'em? I don't think so...and Ed Leeper stepped up to the plate and did a recall. Just my rant for the day.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithisheaven Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 this is absolutely crazy. Diane at cch is a secratary, what the fuck is she doing pulling orders for clients, out of the not-finished bin yet!? god, if she knew her head from her ass she might be dangerous but really. i guess her "relationship" with "dave" keeps her in good standing. I mean people dont trust your cch aliens. these people have no concept of product liability or quality control. reputation is only lost once and then NEVER gotten back. these are potentially life saving devices, by there actions cch has shown they dont care about yours or mine! total boycott of these cams and we all should send ours back used or not and demand a refund. hopefully they will go under soon, please, and we wont have to worry anymore about shit cams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephH Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 this is absolutely crazy. Diane at cch is a secratary, what the fuck is she doing pulling orders for clients, out of the not-finished bin yet!? god, if she knew her head from her ass she might be dangerous but really. i guess her "relationship" with "dave" keeps her in good standing. I mean people dont trust your cch aliens. these people have no concept of product liability or quality control. reputation is only lost once and then NEVER gotten back. these are potentially life saving devices, by there actions cch has shown they dont care about yours or mine! total boycott of these cams and we all should send ours back used or not and demand a refund. hopefully they will go under soon, please, and we wont have to worry anymore about shit cams. Well, if you don't want to use cams from a craft/artisan shop don't, but that's what Aliens have always been. Diane isn't some faceless "worker", she's likely the glue that keeps the whole business running as far as I can tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithisheaven Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 keeps it running to where, the death zone. if diane is keeping cch afloat then none of us should ever call or use them again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancegranite Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Let me put it this way... I work as a rigger, we swage wire rope in our shop all day long. If this happened, there would be a company wide roundtable meeting and the person responsible would be fired. I've seen it happen. Everyone makes mistakes, you just don't get to make THAT one twice. Sad, because I love their products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephH Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I'm not attempting to change anyone's mind in the matter as each person needs to make up their own. That said I am trying to get across a realistic view of CCH. They are more like a blacksmith, glassblower, luthier, or any other craftsman or artisan. And CCH I suspect is like a lot of small businesses where one person is focused on managing production and another manages office functions. CCH simply isn't a "modern manufacturer" nor does it have the culture of one. That's not an excuse, it's what they've always been over the twenty years when folks swore by their gear. They clearly got in over their head with REI and are now are trying to remedy the trouble they find themselves in. It's a case of buying and / or using them or not, but I seriously doubt Diane is going anywhere. And given the way the business is organized I don't think she should; they just need to get formal processes around how they do things including where finished cams are located. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mos_Chillin Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Well put,Joseph. It' been called "the bleeding edge" from what I have heard. To me, CCH irepresents the type of perspective that pushes you to explore your own expectations and perceptions, how fucking safe do you expect to be as a climber? Do you really want to cast your blame so far beyond yourself? Think about it. Personal responsibility is a far cry from your bolt-ups or gyms, but these folks have a history of innovative and superior product. Are you that petty to blame a genius for your own lack of observance. Get Real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Side note: thought I'd take the opprotunity to buy some more cause I send a bunch of dimpled ones back and got a rack of Trango Max Cams as trade (out of the frying pan and into the fire as they say). Now I have too many Aliens. Unless I find myself up El cap and in need of doubles for offsets. Hows this sound: $40 for a brand new Black? Yes, that sounded good to me too. Tradrack.com See - I must have a 15 min attention span and time was up was an hour ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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