size - friends vs. camalots

[todd]

i need some opinions here. most guidebooks/topos use friends to describe the size of cracks and/or the size of pro recommended for a climb. how do these sizes compare to camalots? i know generally how they compare, but is there a rule of some sort (i.e. 3.5 friends = 3 camalots, etc.)? any advice is welcome.

[erik]

dont rely on guidebooks is my advice.....

i mean typically you can look up at a crag route and make the gear judgement right there....(i suspect you are cragging) and i have also found that you can work different gear in then sometime stated....ahh the beauty of trad climbing...not protection limitations........

as for walls go well just bring your normal wall rack and then look for non-tradiotnal items that you might want to bring..ie hooks, rivots etc.....

[Charlie]

Erik- with an answer like that, you should go into politics. I'm curious about the size equivelences also.

[todd]

thanks erik. but this was meant to be more of a techy question with a concrete answer. (ex. yes, a 2.5 friend = a 2 camalot, etc.) have any advice along those lines? thanks in advance.

[Dru]

Camalot +1 = Friend.

So Cam #2 = Friend #3. More or less.

Check out exact size range equuivalency in the MEC catalogue, for instance.

[fern]

In the McNamara Yosemite Supertopo guidebook there's a chart of cam sizes showing the overlap between the major brands. also there's this:http://www.stanford.edu/~agcooper/ActiveProSizeChart.htmland this:http://home.datacomm.ch/leonhard.pang/climbing/slcd.html

and I think a few years ago in R&I there was a Steph Davis article about crack climbing technique that cross-refs crack size (thin fingers, hand, fist etc.) to cam sizes.

also I think (but could be wrong) that a #3 Friend is 3 inches across unretracted, and a #3 Camalot is 3 inches across when halfway retracted, and that this is a fairly general rule for those two brands.

[ 02-25-2002: Message edited by: fern ]

[nobody]

http://www.blackdiamondequipment.com/rockclimbing/pro_cams.html

If you surf by various manufacturers websiates they usually list the expansion range for each cam.

Mountain Gear has a great chart in their catalogue with a side by side comparison, but not on thier website...not sure why?

Good luck

[erik]

well shit i go to lunch comeup with the info come back to lay it on you and bam others have taken care of clod.....must be cause you are from 'r.a.d.o.'....

[freeclimb9]

The numbers associated with Friends translate to their mid-size in inches. Camalots don't have the same scheme --the numbers don't relate to any known measuring convention, and they don't relate to Friend sizes in a formulaic way (at least not a simple formula). I wish they would have used just letters (A, B, C, etc). Their size range is summarized here: http://www.bdel.com/rockclimbing/pro_cams.html

Roughly, I'd compare sizes of Camalots to Friends as:

.5 Camalot about a 1 Friend

.75 ~ 1.5

1 ~ 2.5

2 ~ 3

3 ~ 4

4 ~ 5

[Dru]

what about ZeroCams?

[todd]

thanks all, that was exactly the kind of info i was looking for.