DPS

With effort we could have probably eliminated some of our pin placements by using lowe balls or other things. We brought the iron so we used it.

Matt Anderson, I was giving rack recommendations for Thin Red Line, not Lib Crack. But thanks for telling us all what a rock star you are. And thanks for the ethics lecture. Dan [This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-25-2001).]

You are welcome. When are you thinking about doing TRL?

Bugaboos, small angles, lost arrows (a few each)lots of small Aliens, good assortment of hooks, (include one big one), double set of cams to #3, Hugh Banner offset nuts in the small sizes. We brought but did not use Lowe balls or copperheads.

We used aiders, daisy chains, haul bag, wall hauler, belay seat, fifi hooks, knee pads, ascenders.

I was there 2 weeks ago doing Thin Red Line, the snow at the base was inconsequential, should be almost gone by now. The route can be climbed at 5.9, C2. Definitely not C3.

Oops. I did not realize I was violating buletin board ethics. I guess I better keep it to myself that Whillans is none other than...damn, almost did it again.

I know who you are now Dwayner! You teach archeology at PLU, yes?

Burdo and Windham have indeed climbed the route in a day. Leland told me there is a 1500' approach up to 5.8 and 1500' of the business, up to 5.12. It is not the Dolomite tower route, but an independant line.

I did Fisher Chimneys two weeks ago. It is in fine shape. I have done this route as late as October, it stays in shape all year. Winnie's Slide gets icier though. I second the recommendation. This route has a little of everything, just make sure you find the correct entrance to the chimneys.

The line that is thin and red.

I have vacation time scheduled Aug 4-12 and am looking for partners for a road trip. Canadian Rockies, Tetons and Bugaboos all interest me. Or perhaps closer to home; Pickets, Ptarmigan Traverse. Email me if you are interested: daniel.smith@metrokc.gov

Rodchester, The new Polargard Delta comes closer than any other synthetic to matching the compressiblity and loft of down. No, it certainly does not match 800 fill power (more like 550) but the trade off can be worth it. You keep mentioning the choice comes down to weight which is of course very important but the moisture factor is also critical especially if you are doing multiday 'alpine' routes where there is no chance to dry out a bag. The final straw for me was failing on a huge, 4000+ foot winter alpine route. The weather was stellar, cold and clear, no precip. My Dryloft down bag was inside of a bivi sack but was soaked in the morning from the moisture of my body and clothes being pushed into the down and trapped there by the dryloft and goretex. We knew we would have to bivi again before getting up and over the route, but our wet bags (in addition to a poorly functioning stove) persuaded us to retreat. I have used synthetics in similar situations with much better results. Bart Paul told me one of the reasons for his fast ascent of Cassin Ridge last year (56 hours) was that his partner's down bag had become soaked and useless and he refused to bivi again so they simply kept climbing. Dan [This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-11-2001).]

So far the only argument for down that holds water (pun indended) is the durability issue. Down does last much longer than synthetic and in the long run is more cost effective. The weight and compressibilty arguments are moot, however, as new synthetics have drastically closed the gap. On hard, multiday apline routes it is very difficult to keep the down from absorbing moisture from your sweaty body. Pulling your soggy bag out of the stuff sack after a hard day of climbing really tests your resolve. Down does work best for most situations where one can stop and dry it out, but I have been burned on alpine routes by my high quality, Western Mountaineering Dryloft bag.

Thanks for the play by play. I was wondering if you felt it was worthwile, considering the longish approach.

[This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-10-2001).] [This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-10-2001).]

I was waiting for that. Nick and I have decided to do the line that is red and narrow. We decided we need to improve our hiking to climbing ratio.

Colin, you know my opinion on the subject. My suggestion is to read what other climbers in the know have to say about synthetic, like Bart Paul and Mark Twight. [This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-09-2001).] [This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-09-2001).]

Has anyone been up there recently? I am curious if the route described in Nelson's guide book is dry yet.

That climber must visit the ocean too, because I went to the beach and there were shells everywhere. Disgraceful.

The UW is conducting gravity research using the mass of the cliff as the gravity source. They test the relative speed of beryllium and magnesium in free fall. And that is the real story. [This message has been edited by danielpatricksmith (edited 07-05-2001).]

I would like to get people's opinions on if this is a worthwhile route to do considering its rather long (by Snoqualmie Pass standards) approach.

The Roman Wall is a very wide face. Plenty of room for people to pass. I don't understand what your problem was. What danger were you in exactly?

Yossarian, Is that your real name, or did you choose the alias from Catch 22? Dan

I have since put on much padding and become softer. Haven't broken anything since, so I think it is a winning strategy.