summitchaserCJB

I guess blame is a bad word. But I can't think of anything that could replace it. I don't mean it as in condemn but as assign responsibility for. If I can't be held responsible for my actions, am I not a child?

Well I do blame people for things they are responsible for. That is called responsibility and it is a reality. I don't think the people involved are stupid or bad people necessarily , but I was rather voicing my opinion about what happened in the situation and what I might do differently. What happened is tragic. But maybe it could have been prevented by being more careful around the cornice. In fact I'm surprised the guy got so close. Now blaming the guy is just stupid at this point. He knew that climbing is dangerous, as we all do. It is something we take on knowing that we may get hurt or killed doing it. My .02. But all that really doesn't matter. My thoughts go to the people that cared about him.

What is done is done. But we can learn. "Ultimately, we are all responsible for ourselves when we climb." Yes but we are also responsible for our partners. I believe this to be true, to a degree.

Man. Guess I misconstrued it in my head. Unfortunate. They should stash that stuff nearby JIC.

Dude it is called a helicopter. If they can spend time hovering around they can drop off a team and technical gear. That is my point. They had several hours to do this and apparently didn't. (and Yes I have been up Saint Helens. I'm not saying that decent wouldn't be hard or very dangerous...but really..

No shit that is why you go get him or at least get a sleeping bag. That complacency is BS. Pisses me off.

He was blowing a whistle from the bottom. So he was alive. People depend way too much on heli's and not on their technical ability.

Don't S and R teams have static ropes/sleeping bags/ice tools? Just saying.

I almost popped through a cornice on Baring last winter. Scary stuff. That is one way to learn a lesson. Sorry to hear the conclusion of this one. RIP.

I agree. While it could happen I wouldn't rely on it. I mean what is another couple pounds of fuel anyways?

shoot. Stay warm.

Why not rappel into the crater and get him.

I'd take it as a compliment. That backpack looks itsy bitsy.

I second that comment.

"While this isn't official policy it's pretty close that we will never require people to use their real names. First off, it's not realistically enforceable. Second, there are a litany of reasons to allow people to keep a certain level of privacy that far outweigh the perceived benefits of using peoples real names." Well said.

I want that route bad.

"The voice of inexperience!" Who are you referring to? Me? You don't know me man. Don't hate. If you don't think it is true you are the one who is inexperienced, with all due respect. I think some of the stuff guys do in the mountains is incredible, really. But some of it is just nuts. Right on the edge of sanity. And if they want to do that, so be it. I'll read the TR. I'm not saying inexperience is good either. When I was learning I made my mistakes as we all do. That is what the mountains are all about. I still make mistakes sometimes. That is what it is all about. We like to walk that line between disaster and competence. Not only that but we want to push that line as far as we deem possible for satisfaction.

I agree. Let them do it. Doesn't mean I can't weigh in. Perhaps if you look around you will realize that people die doing sketchy things. Old climbers and bold climbers but no old, bold climbers. I'll leave it at that bro.

" I think you just don't understand this stuff that is way out of your league..." Maybe not. Sorry, I seem to have offended a climbing God. I'm sure there is shit I know a lot more about than you do, including in the realm of climbing. But I won't be the one to show you.

"i climb leashless without umbilicals pretty much all the time. i also read alpinist. i hope i am okay." I donno, your profile says your a noob.

"Im just saying that a 5.14 climber leading a 5.12+ R/X is almost safer than a newbie with no instruction and a shiny new rack trying to lead a 5.8.. placing gear all wrong and skeching up the route. I've seen a lot of it myself but nobody says anything about it, so why say strong climbers leading runout routes withing their abilities is stupid? I think you're stupid." "Just not anytime soon." Ya. Do I even need to respond? The R/X does mean something. Look it up.

Yes!

Groping for Oprah's Naval.

"Media image slaves live by random selection" Ok. But we all select information in a biased fashion. It is called confirmation bias.