prole

Two questions: Was the Pizza Guy there and did anyone address motorist freedoms?

"Motorist freedoms" LOLZ

Welcome to Planet Mercatus!

More free to be limited to choose between a number of bad choices NOW!

How's that austerity thing working out for ya?

Um, yes please!

Yay, #2 in Freedumb!

...brought to you by the Partnership Against Financial Regulation.

CIGARETTE TAXES AND TRANS-FATS BANS TODAY, TOMORROW THE DEATH CAMPS!!

I can only hope that you're a happy, fully-functioning, healthy individual enjoying meaningful relationships when you're not on this board. Good day.

I don't know if that's a fair assessment based on what I written here or not, I wouldn't be the one to say. What I do know is that in the years I've been here the only discernible opinion/worldview/stance you've ever shown is a fierce pride in your own aggressive ignorance. Get off the 'roids and get some psychiatric help.

MAVERICK!

You did say "lexicon", though. Apparently, "narrative" is a bridge too far...

You have no idea what, or how much I read, fuckwit. You're not exactly showing us much, bro.

i'm also hardly ignorant of the pejoratively described "revisionist" historians out there, and while i don't classify myself as a disciple of chomsky or his brethern, i don't dismiss his conclusions out of hand you might also recall that "immigrants" are hardly a static group, and that plenty of immigrant children went on to be the very writers of "mainstream" history you condemn I'm not interested in this kind of talking past each other, I'm sure we agree on and are interested in a lot of the same stuff. It is interesting that for all the complexity you're willing to show existed in previous periods is not reflected when you reduce the current immigration discourse to xenophobes vs. exploiters. Quite a bit more going on than that as it's clear you know.

By accepting a frame of debate that suggests the only two poles that need to be accounted for in a discussion on American immigration are xenophobes and exploiters is giving them far more power to shape how we understand the issue than they deserve.

Actually, at this point Kojak, I think any book at all would be an improvement for you.

ELITIST!!

Try reading a book, ya fucking meathead!

Yes, those are two responses, but that's a rather narrow framework from which to understand something as densely complex as 'immigration in America'. Outside of that official, mostly white, nativist historiography, immigrants themselves never had opinions worth hearing or acted in ways that made a contribution to changing the parameters of debate or the conditions of their existence? Are those experiences, voices, and agency something that we should be taking into account now, or are we just going to pay tribute to and reproduce the xenophobe/exploiter version of events?

Namely, pointing out that the range of immigration debate or the voices worth listening to isn't limited to xenophobes on one end and exploiters on the other? That the immigration "problem" is mostly a fiction? Please be more specific. Only you and progressives are smart enough to define the valid parameters of discussion. Leave that narrow range and it's the same bullshit from you about how we're all dumb, duped, whatever. You and j-bot should just go find a closet somewhere for your endless circle-jerks. No, it's about broadening the range to include more voices and recognizing that what passes for a broad spectrum on any number of issues (economic policy, foreign policy, energy, etc. ) has actually been quite limited. How many examples do you need? If we're to go about solving problems and getting out of the various ruts we're in (don't worry, I know you don't personally give a fuck so nobody's asking you to think about anything), then we should try and identify the narratives that dominate our media space, how they're produced, and who benefits from them.

Namely, pointing out that the range of immigration debate or the voices worth listening to isn't limited to xenophobes on one end and exploiters on the other? That the immigration "problem" is mostly a fiction? Please be more specific.

These are polar views? For whom? Talk about sticking to the script! Apparently, conservatives have gotten so good at defining the parameters of debate that what immigrants, children of immigrants, experts on the subject, and activists working within and on behalf of those communities think, say and do is irrelevant. The "if the feds won't do something, we will" is a gimcrack soundbite designed to appeal to the pre-existing anti-gubmint teabag mindframe. There is no immigrant "problem".

Ivan, this would be a nice little package to see through your tired-ass, one size fits all "same-as-it-ever-was" goggles, but these Arizona-type measures are being introduced in disparate states across the nation.

You know, apart from Wiener's weiner, Palin's bus tour, etc.