payaso

One thing the Mountaineers really beat their drums about is that they require you to go through MOFA (Mountaineering Oriented First Aid) which is about a 30 hour course. Back in 92 I took Wilderness First Responder up in Bellingham through the Red Cross, which is a 90 hour course taught by a REAL PROFESSIONAL who now works for AAI up there. The course was really great and I practically was an EMT by the end of it. The Mountaineers MOFA class is taught entirely by volunteers and doesn't even hold a candle to a real WFR cert. At the conclusion of the WFR in Bellingham I felt that each and every member of the class was as competent as someone can be without professional medical training. I would have trusted any of them with my life in an emergency. The graduates of the MOFA program from the Mountaineers I wouldn't trust with a band-aid. The instruction just totally sucked! The Instructor merely read the textbook to us during class (like I can't do this on my own time)? All said, some first aid training is better than none, but I felt it was pretty low quality. The Mountaineers definately have their faults, but having just graduated from the Basic Climbing class this last year, I have to say that I accomplished a lot of great summits, and learned a lot of new skills that simply would not have been available to me otherwise. Like most, I am looking forward to now just climbing and not marching in groups of 50 on the Nisqually Glacier.

You bitches should be looking here! http://www.oprah.com/

but seriously, try and find ANY difference between some of this crap and what's on Oprah today!

Mr. Panther, don't you think you're taking yourself just a little too seriously?

So I noticed that there were over 70 replies to the latest Mountaineers based post so it must be of more interest to most of you than any other goddamn subject on the board! I admit feeding the flame a little with some slightly degrading remarks about some of the regulars on the board (just for trolling purposes of course) and boy did everyone come out of the woodwork! I gave this a little thought later this weekend and had a drug-induced vision come to me while snowboarding and couldn't help but make a comparison with this and some of those crap daytime TV shows like Oprah, Gerado(sp?) and Sally Jesse whatever, where someone comes out and says to an unsympathetic audience "well I'm actually a Seattle Mountaineer and rather enjoy it." I then envisioned someone emerging from the audience and throwing a chair at the poor SOB on stage, and Oprah discreetly breaking for a commercial while announcing that after the break they will speak with an anonymous Mountaineer (voice and image disguised for security puposes of course) leader who "reserved" a Glacier with little consideration for those others who may want to be on the mountain that day. Some great stories in there by the way and keep it coming. But has this become a "Climber's Oprah?" I must admit I do find it funny to see 50 Mountaineers students gathering at Paradise in a snowstorm with brand new $25 belay gloves hanging from their harnesses as much as anyone else!

I feel really privileged to be amongst such a high caliber on-line climbing crew as you bunch! WAY cooler and with many more rights to be on the mountains than any disdainful group like the Mountaineers. Yeah, the Mountaineers can be awkward and laughable sometimes but so what. They're EVERYONE'S MOUNTAINS! The fact that you are already experienced climbers and they are not means SQUAT! Most of you twits that sit on this board daily are precisely the ones that give climbers a bad name. There is nothing worse than running into climbers with bad attitudes. Maybe it's because no one really cares about your exploits but yourselves. I am curious about some of you, what came first, the self-righteous attitude, or did it develop after years of climbing and following it up with self-aggrandising posts on message boards?

I have a Canon EOS which is a bit heavy for climbing. Make sure to buy a chest harness camera case is what I'm really trying to say. If you have to fuck with it too much you just won't be burning the film. Minoltas are cheaper and lighter weight. Whatever you do, experiment with the damn thing BEFORE YOUR TRIP!!!! Just take stupid shots around town in different light conditions and get it developed before you leave. I had to learn with a whole new system in Alaska and ended up blowing a bunch of shots!

First date this time of year would definately be great for an ice climb of Chair Peak NE Buttress. Actually any movie with Julia Roberts will do the trick.

Gracias to all for the great advice. I think I'm gonna give it a go!

My reluctance to Lead is mostly attributable to my having only summited on 2 rock climbs. It seems that if I go into the Intermediate class I will be starting to lead having only really done 2 peaks.

I finished the Basic Climbing course this year and really enjoyed the experience, as well as the knowledge I gained in about 6 months time. I was able to summit 6 peaks (4 Glacier and 2 Rock) and want to go for more next year. I've heard some of the Pros and Cons about the Intermediate program and would appreciate some thoughts from some people who have found themselves in a similar situation. My perfect situation would be to simply be able to climb at this same level next year with about the same # of climbs. I do not feel ready, nor currently have the desire to lead rock. Do you "develop" this desire to lead rock? Once again, if anyone found themselves in a similar situation please share your thoughts. Thanks. [ 10-25-2001: Message edited by: payaso ]

http://www.gopportal.com/emailoftheday/talibansingles.html

Mariners in 6! The Yankees looked pretty cooked.

I really enjoyed Eldorado! Right in the middle of the N. Cascades National Park with killer views all around! Maybe a more interesting topic could be what was the most unrewarding view from the top of a mountain you've ever seen (not including bad weather).

What is the "moondance?"

We need a lawyer to figure out the details here. If your car gets the ticket, who is legally responsible? What if your roommate borrows your car and doesn't use the pass? If you go to court, can they prove that you were parked there to use the National Forest? How about a big sign on the dash that says "IN TOW."

Enjoy yourself down there! I never got the chance to climb down there but I have had lots of experience driving around the Mexico City area. The first time I drove through that city I was truly left with an adrenaline rush comparable to that of climbing. The police will always be a factor for you, especially if you have US plates or a rental car from DF. The person who paid $100 for a bribe is an idiot though. Way too much. Here's what you do. When you get pulled over (and you will) politely say you are very sorry for any infraction you may have incurred. Do not get pissed off, remain friendly no matter what. Also do not immediately offer $. They will want to have your drivers llicense. Normal procedure for an infraction in Mexico is to retain the license to ensure that you come down to the station some day to settle up. Since you will not be doing this, make sure to buy an international drivers license from AAA that you can leave with them. Also try giving them photocopies of the license. This has worked for me in the past even though they're not usually happy about it. Unlike a police encounter in America, you can completely take control of the situation in your favor down there. Eventually say you are once again very sorry and ask if you can possibly pay the fine right now. Try offering a small amount of money, no more than $10 US. After you agree on a price, act confused and lost (which you will be) and ask if he can show you out of the city in the direction you're going. I did this once and found it to be well worth the ten bucks to find my way out of that place. If you don't speak any spanish, just skip right ahead to the confused and lost bit and speak gibberish to the cop. Try a spoken word version of "Mary had a little lamb" or something like that over and over. They will eventually just get frustrated and let you go. Also have a copy of the bible highly visible by the dashboard. Whatever you do, don't give them your license, just give them a copy, or better yet the AAA disposable one. Good luck! I'm kicking myself for never getting around to going up Popo before it became active. Also the little town of Cholula would be a real nice place to base yourself.

Yes, I'm sure our trail fees are wisely being invested in the maintenance of these roads as we speak.

Just got back from a trip to Montana and had to post this. I was in the Glacier NP parking lot and couldn't find where the cartographers had hidden the magnetic declination for that area on the map. I asked one of the rangers nearby what the magnetic declination was and he said that "It's all about the same anyway." Not knowing and saying so is acceptable, but not knowing that it matters is not. What part of DC do these people come from?

I took WFR back in 93 in Bellingham through the ARC. Kelly Turner was the instructor and now it looks like he runs the show for AAI up there. This was a real first rate program and I would highly recommend it! I recently took MOFA from the Mountaineers and it didn't hold a candle to WFR training. Kelly was very knowledgeable and even trains you in the use of homeopathic rememdies as well. I would personally love to go back up there and take the refresher they offer.

I was just up there on monday and there are quite a few opening up on the field. With so many day hikers going up there, it's only a matter of time before one of them goes into one. Most people don't know what they're getting into. I had to jump one that was at least 3 feet wide. There are wands placed strategically near the best places to cross, but there is still potential to fall in.

One good way to get a pass is to volunteer 2 days of trail maintenance. No revenue is generated and everyone benefits from trails being maintained.

This article today seems very similar to the forest pass. How can they prove that the owner of the vehicle committed the crime?http://seattlep-i.nwsource.com/local/34715_photo10.shtml

These tickets seem unenforceable because they are given to the vehicle, not the driver. The only reason you pay parking tickets is because you'll be going through that city again. Therefore I always pay them in Seattle, but probably wouldn't in say, San Francisco. Since the jurisdiction for the Forest Service is Federal, normal police will not know anything about these violations. Any lawyers out there know what the legal liabilities are between you and your vehicle? What if your roommate drives it up to Alpental and doesn't pay? Are you really responsible?

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