Jim

Latest PNW Forest Plan report say the USFW sold 87 million board feet in CA, OR, and WA combined.

Here's a scenario. We go into Iraq and get the bad guys. Lots of inocents die (by accident of course). We have to foot the bill for occupation, for who knows how long. The radical Muslim community goes nuts. The current Pakistan regime looses its support and is take over by a more fundamental regime. And guess what they have in their storage closet? Meanwhile N. Korea feels emboldened by our distractions and pushes some more. And there's always Al Queda lurking in the shawdows. A bit overextended I would say.

You're kidding right? They stopped short because better a bastard like Sadam in power than a fractionous democracy. That's always been our line in the middle east. Keep despots in power if they toe the line we set (remember the Shah) and ignore human rights abuses. If they get too spunky though, cut them off at the knees. We wave the flag around but we don't care about democracy as long as our "national interests" (read oil, coporate profits) are taken care of.

Let's not bring facts into the issue. And by the way the Bushy Administration conviently left out the entire cost of the war and occupation from this years budget. Guess that comes under the "special" category.

Actually it's all in Tillamook OR now. We have the aerial photos to prove it.

whatever ray zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

If Iraq's main export was rice does anyone think we would be going in there? Get real.

Oh I see. Iraq is much more powerful than those guys. We kept the Soviet Union in check for 30 years. We can't keep lowly Iraq in its borders(!!?). Yea we better go bomb them.

But Iraq has spit in the face of the US and insulted our presidents father!! Heck with Pakistan, India, N. Korea, Israel (pick one nuclear owner). We want the one with oil.

That happens a lot. Glad you're not smoking.

Couple of questions. Does it hurt when you press the bottom of your heel with your thumb? And where, closer towards the heel back or closer to the mid part of the heel? If it hurts towards the back end it could be a heel spur. Hurting in the middle of the heel is often a component of plantar faciatis, kinda tearing of the arch fiberous material. Heel spurs often need operations, plantar faciatis can be a chronic problem. There's some good running websites that discuss injuries. If you haven't been seeing a foot guy that sees runners there are a few that advertise in Northwest Runner, or ask at Jock and Jill for a reference.

I think the point of the orginal thread is that the screws are put to lower end social programs while no one gripes about the free ride the upper income is getting from the proposed tax cuts or the wasteful spending for defense. Compartively the social programs pale in costs. So some family of 4 earning $25k instead of $24k gets in under the wire. So what? Here's an example from the other end. During the competition for the Joint Strike Fighter, Lockeed, one of the contractors, went $3 million over budget. The judging criteria were cost, construction efficiency, and technical plane applications. No one blinked at the $3 million cost over-run and Lockeed won the competition. This is a minor example. No one calls for the complete overhaul of the military because of this wasteful spending. But we're going to institute a paper chase to root out the slackers on the free lunch program. Give me a break. You want your kids to learn more? Get the feds off the teachers backs.

Actually most FS sales are done at a loss and it's not because of USFS overhead. The sales are set up under congressional guidlines, basically a subsidy for the timber industry. They don't pay for the full cost of the needed timber crusing, surveying, road building, road maintenance, environmental studies, etc. Now a valid argument is that these timber roads are often used by recreation folks so they should cough up some money to use them. IMO I think that the timber companies should be pay their way, not getting by on taxpayer handouts. The Brookings Institute and the Cato Institute, both very conservative and libertarian think tanks, have recommended raising the timber fees to reflect market value rates. Most of private timber land was clearcut in an unsustainable rate, that's why they're always knocking on the USFS door. Back to the main thread - the Enchantments need some type of management, or else it would look like the trail up Mt. Si on a sunny weekend. The recreation folks and other technical USFS staff are often trying their best, despite the management of timberheads and the politics of it all.

Grim and getting grimmer. What is it with this administration? They are undoing years of bi-partisan work under the cover of the war drums. "The Bush administration is acting to overturn a Clinton-era management plan for the 11 national forests of the Sierra Nevada, replacing the conservation-based approach with one that would significantly accelerate logging. The possible torpedoing of the Sierra Nevada Framework Plan was revealed Monday in a document leaked to environmental organizations by a "concerned inside source," said Jay Watson, the western regional director for the Wilderness Society. The document, obtained by The Chronicle, is the first draft of a proposal on how to update the Sierra Nevada Framework Plan. The revisions have been in the works for months." "The (draft) has been very controversial inside the forest service," said Watson. "It's creating tremendous internal divisions. If Bush goes through with these changes, it will end in polarization, conflict -- and ultimately, a federal courtroom." (SanFrancisco Chronicle 2/4)

Good question. It may depend on avalanche conditions and the snow clearing needed highger up. I've been let in early and once waited until 2pm for the gate to open. That was fun. Was the sking any good?

I'm not sure why they're called "conservatives". They're certainly not fiscally responsible. After getting beginning to get the budget deficit under control we're headed back to la-la land. More tax cuts for the upper end and whopping deficits. In the long run it stifiles the amount of capital available for long-term investments. Ronnie and his budget guy, Stockman, first came up with this lame-o idea, and then had to admit it didn't work and we were left cleaning up their budget mess. I'd rather tax and spend then the proposed borrow and spend. We'll be paying for it soon enough.

Opinion polls show that 70% of the British public feel that no good case has been made for war on Iraq. Figures from the US suggest that opposition to an invasion with US ground troops is at 43%, up from 38% in a poll taken January 10-12 and up from 20% in a poll taken in November. Support for an invasion is at 52%, down from 56% in January and 74% in November. 56% say UN weapons inspectors should be given more time to complete their search for banned chemical, biological and nuclear weapons (AP/UPI 1/27/03). These are remarkable figures from a country subjected to the most sophisticated and intensive system of propaganda ever devised. Nevertheless the media tirelessly attempt to keep us sealed in a bubble of pro-war propaganda. Iraqi generals aside, anti-war voices are almost totally excluded - no one in the media is interested in stepping outside the bubble to explore why the German and French public and politicians, and huge numbers of countries and people around the world, view the US/UK position as a farcical cover for an oil grab. Virtually the entire world is shaking its head in stunned disbelief at Bush and Blair's brazen audacity, but not our media.

Ch-Ch-Chain Reaction

Helmets may not be the answer. http://www.freep.com/news/health/rec28_19991228.htm

Good you got out, but for those who don't know, Sperry and Vesper are off the Mountain Loop Hwy.

Trask. Nice picture but I think it's the 5.8 variation of Three Pines at the Gunks.

Sigh. Not this again. Check the past threads for a discusison of the Atta urban legend.

This is good information. I'm getting into swimming because of a chronic low back thing. Doesn't seem to like long bike rides or runs if I do it a couple days in a row. Thus swimming. How long did it take you to get comfortable with longer swimming workouts. And were you able to move back into biking or running more because of the swimmng. Thanks.

Be careful about the orthotics thing. Most podiatrists will want to solve anything with them. I ran with a club in college and a saw a couple guys develop some hip problems after getting orthotics to solve foot or knee problems. It could be runner's knee or irritation of the patella tendon. Those are easily solved by quadriceps isometric exercises. Runners often develop an imbalance in muscle groups so mixing your exercise regime also helps. I think I would start by doing some reading of common running injuries and treating them yourself before trying the podiatrist. Don’t forget to update your shoes either. If you’re a regular runner 7-8 months is all it takes to start wearing them out.

One of the provisions of the voter initiative was to provide funding to reduce classroom sizes. My wife is a geologist with a masters degree and 15 years experience who went back for her teaching certificate and now teaches middle school science and health. It’s one heck of a lot of work if you really care about the kids. She averages about 60 hours a week. I chip in and help set up hands on science activities for the kids and help grade. In the summer she plugs along, adding to her curriculum and taking a class or two. With mandatory days in the summer she maybe gets 6 weeks to work at her own pace. She and her fellow teachers are always working holidays and weekends. She loves it, though it is exhausting. I couldn’t do it, and living in Seattle we can afford only one teacher in the family. These days schools are being asked to solve a pile of social ills. The kids spend 7 hours in school, so most of the time they’re at home or elsewhere in the community. The most reliable indicator of a school’s test score is how many kids qualify for the free or reduced lunch program. It’s just easier for the politicians to try and mandate performance standards than address the larger social problems, or fund schools to the degree we say we care about education.