Icicle Vandals

[W]

Gene, I didn't take your comments that way, I just want it to be clear that the Rainier program was formed out of many issues. There were climbing rangers on the mountain all the way back to the 70's

 

Probably more like the 1920's or thirties. Definitely by the late forties and early fifties with people like Georege Senner and the Molenaars, there was a system of climbing rangers.

 

Yeah, that's true, Bill Butler and Charlie Brown also did many rescues. I guess I have always considered the first iteration of the modern program to have began in the 1970's when the environmental impact component began getting more heavily integrated into the duties of the upper mountain rangers. John Dalle-Molle (who initiated a park-wide backcountry impact study), Jim Springer, Bundy Phillips, and others are the ones I'm thinking of. But you are correct that it has been an evolving process from way back.

 

But the need for "Climbing Rangers" on Rainier, in Alaska, the Tetons and Yosemite is miles different than the need on Bruce's Boulder.

 

Oh, I agree completely; this discussion was just a sidebar.

[tvashtarkatena]

Rainier actually is World Class , and the crowds, which are concentrated primarily on only two routes, warrant additional regulation to prevent a punami. The climbing rangers I've met on Rainier have been wonderful; I have nothing but respect and gratitude for what they do, as well as the particularly kind and generous way they've treated my climbing parties in the past.

 

There is no 'anti climbing ranger' or 'government is bad' argument here. Only an 'anti-climbing ranger at a local crag called Icicle Creek' argument, due to the very real risk, based on copious data concerning that particular district, that such a program will result in a permit system just for roadside cragging.

[JayB]

[Coldfinger]

I'll add this one thing, as it seems overlooked but on p[oint to the original post AND the thread:

 

The "locals" have clearly addressed the "problem" of painting the rock and did so WITHOUT any USFS help.

 

So....

 

Not to say the Rangers aren't needed, but it is clear the climbing community CAN handle problems.

 

Well done!