chris Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Well, how big a place are we talking about? You said you were getting a guide book ready, implying pages and pages of routes - at least a staple-back. If we're only talking about a one page wall/crag/sector topo, like the Fee Demo Wall, then your OP isn't relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountainmatt Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I think it would be more helpful to have a -5 to +5 star rating. Then you would start to really know the value of a route. Who is going to line up for a route with -5 stars? If the route has any positive stars, you would at least know it was worth climbing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markd Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 kevin, some things to think about: - why do you feel the need to write a guidebook? - what do the other developers think of said guidebook? - how will you go about giving star ratings? based off consensus? - who is your target market? - do you feel like the most qualified person to do this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 are you a local? have you climbed all the routes?how does the community feel about it? did you ask your mother if it's ok? Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markd Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 andrew, your inability to have an educated conversation is astonishing! Â i'm not playing your game. do you have anything on topic to say? Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted January 11, 2007 Author Share Posted January 11, 2007 kevin, some things to think about: - why do you feel the need to write a guidebook? - what do the other developers think of said guidebook? - how will you go about giving star ratings? based off consensus? - who is your target market? - do you feel like the most qualified person to do this? Â - why do you feel the need to write a guidebook? The guide is more of a list, and its for me. - what do the other developers think of said guidebook? Not sure, once again, this "list" is for me. - how will you go about giving star ratings? I wont. That is what this topic has been about. I dont want to guide/direct people to certain climbs, that is if it ever goes public. - who is your target market? There is none. Its not for sale. Not at this time. - do you feel like the most qualified person to do this? Most qualified? Unsure. But I do know that there are about 5 of the 61 routes there that I have not climbed, I would say Im qualified for a list of climbs. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markd Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 Â - why do you feel the need to write a guidebook? The guide is more of a list, and its for me. - what do the other developers think of said guidebook? Not sure, once again, this "list" is for me. - how will you go about giving star ratings? I wont. That is what this topic has been about. I dont want to guide/direct people to certain climbs, that is if it ever goes public. - who is your target market? There is none. Its not for sale. Not at this time. - do you feel like the most qualified person to do this? Most qualified? Unsure. But I do know that there are about 5 of the 61 routes there that I have not climbed, I would say Im qualified for a list of climbs. Â thanks for your honest answer, however i don't understand why you would need to have star ratings on routes you already climbed, if this "list" is for you. Â Â Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 One inevitably winds up sharing a thing, even it it's just for you. For instance, I'm likely to take Kevin up on his offer of a tour there sometime, and I'd no doubt try to pry a guide out of his hot little fingers. Â Qualified? Part of writing a guide is being the one with the chutzpah to do a fairly thankless task, and the willingness to spend the time doing it. I suppose in the modern world it's possible to actually make money doing it, but there's lots of ways to make money. Writing a guidebook is mostly a labor of love. Â For small areas, stars are somewhat superfluous anyway. What did he say, 61 routes? A single crag? One's eyes should be enough to assess. Ditto for my little 35 route home crag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 andrew, your inability to have an educated conversation is astonishing! Â i'm not playing your game. do you have anything on topic to say? Â Â I call BS on your "educated conversation" it was quite reasonable to view your post as putting Kevbone down. Anyway that's how I took your post. Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markd Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 peter, where did i put kevin down? ( we're friends ) i have a vested interest as i've put up routes there. Â this crag has the potential access issues as well. i just want to be sure a guide is the right thing to do, which by the way is the title of this thread, not "lists". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink_chalk Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 One inevitably winds up sharing a thing, even it it's just for you. For instance, I'm likely to take Kevin up on his offer of a tour there sometime, and I'd no doubt try to pry a guide out of his hot little fingers. Â Kevy, I love you more than my luggage, however, I would attempt to take advantage of you because of my hopeless memory of finding routes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 peter, where did i put kevin down? ( we're friends ) i have a vested interest as i've put up routes there. Â this crag has the potential access issues as well. i just want to be sure a guide is the right thing to do, which by the way is the title of this thread, not "lists". Â From the structure of your questions assumed that you had info on this place and were not too keen on the idea of a guide being published. Your pointed questioning of Kevbone seemed a condescending imitation of Socrates. Questioning designed to lead him to the conclusion he was not the right man to write the guide. Why not just come out and say what you think or suggest ways for Kevbone to create his guide. Anyway that was the way I understood your post. I assume Pink thought likewise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted January 11, 2007 Author Share Posted January 11, 2007 This thread was started because I wanted to start a conversation about guide books in general. Stars vs no stars. The fact that I am working on info related to a new climbing area came up later in the conversation. Mark I for surely did not take offense at your words. I, of all people know how you feel. We have been friends and climbing partners a long time. This thread got slightly off topic ( which is the norm on cc.com). Either way the info being compiled is literaly just a list. As soon as I add stars and adjectives. I would think it would become a guide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 andrew, your inability to have an educated conversation is astonishing!  i'm not playing your game. do you have anything on topic to say?   mark, your inability to take a joke is astonishing!  mark, i was agreeing with you, i threw the mother thing in because that's my personality. i am sorry that i came off being an asshole to you and i did not think that you were bagging on kevin either.  everything is cool and i didn't take offense to your comment, mearly because you don't know me that well.  peace out,  andrew     Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I can feel a group hug coming on....... Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I can feel a group hug coming on....... Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I can feel a group hug coming on....... Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I can feel a group hug coming on....... Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted January 11, 2007 Author Share Posted January 11, 2007 Im down with hugs....I like hugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink_chalk Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 Can't we all just get along? sickie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink_chalk Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I'd like to give Mark a hug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 Some pitches are better than others and that's what stars are for. Think of the Smith guide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 andrew, your inability to have an educated conversation is astonishing! Â i'm not playing your game. do you have anything on topic to say? Â Â mark, i do beleive that you diverted the topic yourself and i don't think kevin is fishing for info for his own guide. if kevin is going to put out a guide and you disagree with it, maybe it would have better to p.m. him. what was your angle with your post to kevin anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 I can feel a group hug coming on....... Â Â Well, this isn't the Eastern Washington forum. Admit it, you miss Donny Baker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted January 11, 2007 Author Share Posted January 11, 2007 Some pitches are better than others and that's what stars are for. Think of the Smith guide. Â Yes I know that, thanks. Who decides how many stars? This is where personal opinions come into play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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