Alpine_Tom

quote: Originally posted by texplorer: If you summit before sunrise you greatly reduce your chances of rockfall. Actually, a lot of the rockfall seemed to be caused by people above the chute, either coming up or down. That's what caused that huge rock to come down. Certainly warming makes it worse, but the safest way to climb the hogsback this time of year is to be the first team up. You can, however, go up a chute to the left, avoiding a lot of the rockfall hazard (as long as you make it through the water ice.) We didn't do that because I didn't think Michael would be able to front-point up it. One unforseen problem with climbing with a very short person is he can't use the steps adults have kicked into the steep snow; his legs just weren't long enough. And, it appears that if you took a line up the left, bypassing the pearly gates entirely (called, I think, the old chute, or the Mazama route?) it looks to be safer, if you were up there predawn.

quote: Originally posted by Fairweather: Shall our nation now break the bank on debatable science? I've heard estimates as high as 1 trillion dollars to implement Kyoto. There is plenty of evidence to suggest that implementing the Kyoto protocols will SAVE money. There are all sort of ways this happens: if you reduce fuel consumption to reduce emissions, you also save the cost of the fuel, and reduce demand, which further reduces the cost (if you are a believer is supply & demand.) Increased global temperatures are leading to tropical diseases like malaria moving northward, causing increases in medical costs. I guess, in accordance with the bizarre new fact-based mode of arguement that this thread is peretrating, I should provide some links and other documentation for my claims, but I'm at work and am (annoyingly) pretty busy today.

What a remarkable coincidence! I climbed the route with MY buddy’s 12-year-old son this weekend as well. We did it as an overnight, and summited Sunday. He displayed a remarkable tenacity for someone so small (he’s about 70 pounds, and small for his age) In my experience, the problem with hiking with kids is keeping them interested; they usually get bored or lose their motivation well before they get physically tired. By contrast, I think Michael pushed himself to his physical limit, and the wind and dampness at the summit really sucked the strength out of him. And the conditions ARE quite hazardous. The “pearly gates” are now “chossy gates;” there’s a stretch of water ice and an almost constant rockfall. As we were descending the upper hogsback, a rock the size of an engine block came bounding through; anyone in the chute would have been killed. I suppose the numerous other softball-sized rocks would have done the same thing. IMHO, the route ought to be finished for the year. But I bet there were two dozen others up there.

I've done Glacier Peak in a day, and it's a very long slog. Much longer than Sulphide glacier, Eldorado, or Baker, I think. I bet if you hauled your friend up and down Glacier peak in a day, to "see if you're ready for Rainier" he'd say, man, this climbing stuff sucks! What about Mt. Daniel? It's a good, full day, with some glacier travel, interesting scenery. Or Hood, for that matter, though the drive down and back is a drag. You'd probably want to leave town at midnight. Either one of those would be far more interesting than Mailbox, or three laps up Mt. Si (though that would have a certain zen attraction to it. If you've got the self-discipline to do THAT, you can probably make yourself do just about anything.) The problem with Little Tahoma, as I've whined about elsewhere, is that you have to register, and you can't register before 9:00 AM. Other than that, it seems like a pretty practical one-day climb, and people do it fairly frequently.

Two weekends back, I ended up at Pyramid Lake, up on the N. Cascades highway, after an attempt on Silver Star Peak got rained out. (It’s the lake that you pass on the way up to Pyramid Peak.) It’s a small lake, maybe half an acre and is interesting in that there are no fish. Sitting there by the lake, enjoying the lack of mosquitoes in the sun, I noticed some bizarre little insects hovering over the lake. There were hundreds of them, much larger than mosquitoes (envision veeeery small hummingbirds) and they were bouncing up and down maybe six inch, a foot or two above the surface of the lake. Not going anywhere, just bouncing up and down in the same spot. Anyone know what the heck I saw? Are they snafflehound larvae?

quote: Originally posted by Government Watch Dog: ...And to limit your paranoia boys and girls, Oh my god, the Feds are trying to limit our paranoia! It's a conspiracy!

Thank you for clearing that up, Mike. When I was told over the phone that I COULD self-register last year, it was in November. I didn't understand that it was only allowed during the off-season. You mention that if we "have an issue with access" then you will try to work something out. That certainly sounds promising, but when I talked to the climbing ranger on Wednesday (I didn't get his name, sorry, he sounded young, does that help?) he made it sound like there was nothing he could do, that's just the way things are. I am probably not going to try to do any more one-day Rainier ascents, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who are interested in that. But I can't imagine setting aside two days for Little Tahoma. Besides, if it's a matter of restricting access to high camps, then a one-day climber is by definition not going to affect that. In fact, by not allowing self-registering for one-day climbers, you're increasing the burden on campsites, since it's not possible to do a one-day climb starting at 7:00 AM. I don't particularly want to be an outlaw (I reserve RAMROD for that) and would prefer to be compliant with regulations. It appears, though, that to be compliant, I can't climb Little Tahoma, unless I wait until October. Is there someone I should specifically I should call if I want to discuss the possibility of "self-registering" for a one-day climb? How about your cell phone, Mike? You could get "Alpine Buddy of the week" for sure if you gave us that!

Not mentioned by Allison, I've gotten good deals from GearExpress.com. Their "really cheap" selection is sort of limited, but the blowouts are very cheap, and they ship quickly.

No yaks either, in Pakistan. It'd be goat-to-goat, I guess.

Actually, as I think back on it, the first challenge was figuring out where exactly to go from the parking area. I mean, do you head up the road a mile, or down, or what? This is where having someone who's done it before helps. The answer is, you cross the river pretty much at the parking area. The log is (was) about 50 feet downstream from where we parked.

quote: Originally posted by Cpt.Caveman: Tom, Was that your first climb or did you climb it before knowing the way and all? A valid question not a smart ass one. I find it easier to do that way most of the time. Just curious. It was my first time up there. The route wasn't at all hard to follow, once we found the trail across the river. (That was the tough part, we probably wasted twenty minutes wandering around looking for anything that looked like the real trail.) But once you're on the trail, it's not difficult to follow. For us, there enough others heading up and down that routefinding wasn't much of a challenge. Overall, I'd say routefinding was similar to Sulphide Glacier.

quote: Originally posted by Matt: How hard is it to climb Eldorado in a day? It looks reasonable, but Nelson's book makes it sound like a death march. I've done it, and didn't think it was that arduous. We hit the trail around 7:15 (this was June, 2000, and that tree discussed above was there then, or one very like it) and were back to the car by 7:00 PM. We didn't push like crazy, and took some breaks. (My partner twisted his ankle, and didn't summit, but this slowed our descent some too.) It's pretty stunning scenery up there; Inspiration glacier would be a great place to camp. While we were up there, another group of about a dozen people (not Mountaineers)were also doing a one-day climb, and we saw a few others doing it too. The catch is that (I think) you'd need to do the approach in daylight, and so by the time you're heading down, the snow is really wet and sloppy. That was my experience, anyhow. Crevasse danger was non-existant, so far as I could tell. If you're interested, you can read my account at http://www.nwog.org/reports/060400eldorado.htm

I called the MR climbing conditions number yesterday (to look into conditions on Little Tahoma) and discovered that they no longer allow self-registration. This means, among other things, that one-day climbs are a thing of the past, unless you are so fast you can start after 7:00 AM. Otherwise, I guess they want you to show up by 1:00 AM (when, according to the recording, the climbing ranger office closes) and hang around the parking lot all day taking up a parking space. The climbing ranger I eventually spoke with was pretty sympathetic, he said he’d told his superiors the same thing, but I guess it’s about as open to negotiation as trail park permits. The really annoying part is that, had I not gotten the answering machine, I wouldn’t have known this. It’s not anyplace on their website that I’ve noticed, and it seems like a fairly important change in policy (as of last fall, I was told self-registering was fine) ought to be advertised fairly explicitly. Maybe the thing to do is just go, and if you’re caught, say “gosh, I didn’t realize, here’s my fee.” And if you’re not caught, then the hell with them. I guess this is part of the ongoing process of turning the Park into an RV destination and keeping out those smelly climbers, who don't buy souvenirs or postcards, or even pay tribute to RMI.

This whole question of radically different prices in different countries is pretty mysterious to me. I understand why prescription drugs are cheaper in Canada, because Canada has price controls and the US doesn’t. But that doesn’t seem to follow with climbing gear. Or does Spain have socialized recreation? It seems like a BD ice axe made in the US ought to cost MORE for Barrabes than REI, since it gets shipped about five times farther, gets handled by customs, and probably REI buys in larger quantities anyhow. In the retail places that I’ve worked, years ago, standard retail markup was 40%. A Black Diamond Rage ice tool has a list price of $199.50, so wholesale is probably around $120, more or less. Barrabes sells it for 140.11, so that’d give them a margin that’s thin, but better than most PC hardware. REI, however, sells it for... $199.50. The argument is always that the local shops provide the expertise. That’s certainly true in some places, but that’s what they say with all sorts of stuff. Like bicycle gear, where you can get stuff mail order (without going offshore) for half what local shops charge, but in most cases the guy behind the counter doesn’t know any more about it than I do, and he’s too busy chatting with his buds to sell to me anyhow. I’ll happily pay more for gear from a local retailer who knows what he’s talking about (like PMS) than mail order, but I feel no obligation to subsidize the flagship REI store. That said, it does grate on me that people will go in, take a salesman’s time, and then ask them to write down the model names and numbers, so they can buy it elsewhere cheaper. That happened to me often enough when I sold PCs. (I actually had a guy come in and ask me to help him hook up a printer that I’d demoed to him, he bought mail-order, and then couldn’t make work! Another customer, a woman, asked to borrow the yellow pages and the phone on my desk so she could call a shop down the street to see if they had something I'd recommended cheaper!)

A lot of my climbing has been solo, mostly because it’s so difficult to get all the stars in alignment – a partner with similar interests/abilities/motivations, similar times off, etc. I guess everyone’s had the situation where on Wednesday, you’ve got a party of four lined up for something, and by Friday, everyone’s had to cancel. Because I don’t get out that much, it really frosts me when a partner bails because he’s ‘just not into it’ or was up too late drinking last night. A few years ago I went on a mild climb with a couple of guys (early spring on Church Mountain.) It was a three hour drive up there, and half an hour up the trail, one of them said, ‘oh, by the way, I have to be back in Seattle for a dinner by five.’ So, we spent about twice as long on the highway as on the trail, and turned around just as things were getting interesting. OTOH, I find that solo climbing is much harder mentally. It’s really valuable to have a sanity check, someone to verify that this line is safe, or settle you down when you’re weirding yourself out (or, to say, “man, this is nuts! Look at this rockfall!”) And it seems like on every climb, there’s a point where I start to lose motivation, like towards the end of a long approach, when I’m sick of slogging up a trail, and tired from getting up at 2:00 AM, and having someone else along helps push through the flat spots. Plus, when you're out there, enjoying a fabulous climb, fabulous scenery, or just having fun, it's more fun to be able to share it. And, of course, when you’re soloing there’s much less margin for error, and a lot of stuff that it’s just not safe to do alone.

quote: Originally posted by Gimpy: The real issue here is that maybee, just MAYBEE, telephone solicitors aren't all servants of Hell. I disagree. Doesn't the Good Book say that the Devil can appear with the voice of an angel? I suspect that's what happened here.

I say Scuba-Climbing rules. Dennis Yes, but would you die for it? If necessary?

Cool! That's what makes it one of the "Fify Classic Climbs" I guess. I had no idea the rangers were so helpful. That must be one on the changes Gator initiated.

...but there are a lot of former (and current?) military types around here. Some of these are pretty funny: http://www.skippyslist.com/

quote: Originally posted by IceIceBaby: Is the Ice axe mandatory? can you do with rock or a stick? You only need the ice axe if you fall. If not, it's just wasted weight. Maybe you could self-arrest with a stick. Probably not a rock, though.

I’d be really careful about descending the hourglass if you didn’t ascend from that side, since it separates (it isn’t technically a bergschrund, I guess, but it looks like it) and it’s steep enough that you might not be able to tell it’s not contiguous until it’s too late. (Unless, of course, you’re comfortable downclimbing or rappelling down the rock.) When I did Fisher Chimneys a few years ago in mid-June, it already had a ten-foot gap in it. I’d suggest the extra half hour of going down hell’s highway might be worth it, at least for me.

quote: Originally posted by Dru: What about good old BACON. Ed Abbey, in his books, is always cookin bacon for breakfast. You take a pound or so and fry it up good and you arent gonna get cold AT ALL during the day. Bacon taped over a blister will also heal it, and you can cut a slit in the bacon and put it over your eyes if you forgot your sunglasses.... Read Wm. O'Douglas's "Of Men and Mountains" They went on two-week hikes with a cast-iron skillet, five pound sacks of beans, flour, sugar, slabs of bacon, etc, all rolled up in a blanket. You could use the skillet for glissades, which cleans the bottom.

The part of all this I find frustrating is that the breathless media coverage of climbing deaths seem to spur interest in novices joining the ranks. After the Everest disasters of '96, record numbers of people were inquiring about guided climbs on Everest. I bet the phones at RMI have been ringing off the hook this week. Personally, I find it distasteful to refer to climbing deaths as "darwinism at work" particulary in reference to the Hood accident last week, where one slip (apparently) knocked down a bunch of other (presumably) careful climbers. Maybe the darwinist response is, don't climb Hood, or don't use the hogsback? I agree, though, the coverage is more likely to increase public acceptance of charging climbers for rescues. Mr. Gauthier's statistics of how much the park service spends on rescues of climbers vs. non-climbers don't mean much; most folks aren't climbers, and are perfectly happy with charging others for costs they don't have to bear.

quote: Originally posted by Cpt.Caveman: I think Juan has the most ascents of that NB Couloir than anyone I know. I have been up it once. Pretty cool I suppose. Oh yeah is this the Tom I met in Lworth a few weeks ago? Nope, not me. I'm terrified of rock, just ask Alex.

June 3. Headed up there Monday (I’d arranged for the day off for a Sun-Mon Rainier climb, which fell though.) The parking lot was empty when I arrived. Left the lot at about 7:45, got to the lake in about two hours, where I hung out for a snack and to enjoy the view. The trail is almost completely snow-free, but is really sloppy the last half mile or so. Colchuck glacier was in perfect condition; I could probably have made it up without crampons, but felt more secure having them. Got to the saddle around 12:45, and was on the summit half an hour later. There was a lot of annoying punching through the snow around the rocks up there (as there was around the west side of the lake) but otherwise no difficulties. The summit book, tragically, was filled about five years ago (the entries go from 1995 to 1997; I thought the mounties were supposed to maintain these things!) On nifty surprise; below the summit, looking over at Stuart, you can see Colchuck Balanced Rock from behind. I sure wish I understood the geologic forces that stuck that rock up on that hill. I’d planned to descend to the col and traverse Dragontail as well, descending Aasgard pass, but bagged it, wanting to get home before midnight. Conditions looked good for it, thought; there was a clear set of footsteps heading up the couloir up the back side; beyond that it seems to be a longish scramble. The descent, of course, is one of the exceptional Cascade glissades.It’s steep enough that I was able to glissade from the col to the lake (nearly half a vertical mile!) except for the flat spot 2/3 of the way down. Ran into a couple of guys camped by the lake, planning on doing the Dragontail traverse Tuesday. Hope the weather held for them. One other couple, out for a day hike up to the lake, apparently (no packs) and that was all the people I saw. Another empty crowded climb. Didn’t take or need snowshoes (except I was wishing I had them up among the rocks at the summit!) Back to the car by 5:30 or so for that long boring drive back down HW 2.