mattp

If I might be so bold as to propose a pubclub hijacking, I would say that my back yard is a very nice place to enjoy the sunset and you all would be welcome to come over and sit on our back deck this evening. It'd be a garden pubclub. It's a long way from Ballard, as I live in NE Seattle over near NOAA/Sand Point/Magnuson Park, but Dave Schuldt could ride here via the Burke Gillman (two blocks away) and folks could bring their six packs instead of paying $14.00 for a pitcher. I'll post a link to directions if you folks might be so inclined.

I agree that #21 (the first one that Mr. White has posted above) looks like Yokum Ridge. If so, I'm not sure if it is from the "back" side or simply turned backwards. I don't think the sun gets far enough north to shine that way on the back side.

Fairweather, you have been calling me delusional, paranoid, full of conspiracy theories, etc. for four or five years. In virtually every political argument, and even in many discussions related to climbing, you go out of your way to insult the other guy. There are few on this entire board who have been as "shrill" as you. As I stated in my first responsive post, I was impressed that you were man enough to admit your revelation on cc.com, but where you then seek to use that revelation as a springboard to justify further personal attack, I call B.S. Show us your stuff: stick to the argument.

Isn't late afternoon the only time that Nevermind is actually NOT shaded?

That is a pretty impressive piece of firewood in the road, isn't it?

I have a hard time seeing how the fact that Bill Gates is a major philanthropist has much to do with whether or not a free market or a more regulated economy is better, or whether taxses are good or bad or whether the government wastes tax money. I have not hear Bill arguing that (and certainly not his father).

True. I also think that everyone should expect other parties NOT to do so and take appropriate precautions. In this case, I'm not sure there were any appropriate precautions, but I don't find it hard to picture such a thing as somebody skiing over your glacier rope and while I'd be yelling at the guy too I think there was probably little harm done. Inspecting the rope, can you even tell where the "damage" occurred? What does it look/feel like? Whether it is the Easton Glacier on Mount Baker, or the Outer Space route on Snow Creek Wall, chances are better than 50% that, on any given day, somebody is going to do something you think is either obnoxious or maybe even dangerous. I'm not making excuses for all the idiots in this world, but one way to minimimze that is to climb non-standard routes.

I don’t think it was smarmy, but it WAS a bit manipulative to state “OK, I was wrong - and now YOU are mean to suggest that I should have realized this three years ago.” Of course, you’ll see plenty of smarm in that N Korea thread.

Even though it doesn't necessarily look mossy, P-1 of Beetle Bailey gets a letter grade easier with a good wire brushing, though I suppose repeated brushing might actually polish in such a way as to make it harder.

On Exfoliation Dome, Jacob's Ladder and Rainman are shaded until noon. Dark Rhythm nearly so. On a hot sunny day, I'd just get up early and do one of those and plan on calling it swim time when the sun starts roasting. Dreamer, facing SE, is probably the worst of the lot for getting sun fried.

Fairweather, You've been calling me names and saying I've been smoking pot and whatever for four or five years. You gotta let me bask in a moment of glory - if only for ten minutes. I'm sure we'll be hard at it again tomorrow, OK? More smarm: Don't feel bad. Most Americans have been similarly fooled by all of this, and I'm afraid the spin and lies and fear mongering will continue. I'm seriously worried about the health of our "democracy."

The repeated visits to the CIA were definitely reported at the time. So too were claims that resources were diverted from trying to catch Bin Laden. And the fact that the meeting in Prague was denied by virtually everyone who had any real knowlege of the relevant events was pointed out almost as soon as they started talking about it. There were also reports about the special "pipeline" for "supporting" information, and the European press covered the repeated warnings from the analysists that the Uranium purchase documents were not trustworthy. Much of that other factual stuff, too, was available long ago. It was all passed off as just more politically motivated spin, and maybe only now you are seeing someone that you actually trust saying these things, but it was all there.

Fairweather, I'm impressed by your post. Before we went into Iraq I argued that we should have been talking about something along the lines of this: Saddam is a bad guy, and he is only getting worse, so we may in fact find we have to invade or take other serious action sooner or later. We never had that discussion. I believe we should have a similarly frank discussion now, based on an honest analysis of how what is happening in Iraq is likely to play out, and how this or that possible intervention on our part may actually help or hurt our prospects for long term security or even prosperity (and we should similarly be discussing the reality in any number of other dangerous parts of the world). Sadly, I don't think we'll ever see such discussion. Certainly the debates in Congress are nothing but a charade. I actually DO believe some of the "oil/Halliburton bullshit," but that is neither here nor there. I would point out, however, that nearly all of the information that you saw in that piece the other night was available in the mainstream press at least three years ago if you were really watching.

PP - Did you watch TV the other night? Do you STILL maintain I was wrong, three years ago, when I said Bush and company were lying?

Yes, but did he lie to take us into war? I'm still waiting to hear what Fairweather thought of the TV show the other night. And, in a similar vein, has anybody here read this? Vanity Fair The liberal media has some rather detailed reporting about how BushCo were told over and over again that their "facts" were untrue before they reported them as "facts" to Congress and the U.N.

Right on, Kellie.

Righit on, Gents. I have long held the opinion that might be a good climb.

Allright then. Book reports due tomorrow.

Here's some news you might not want to miss: FRONTLINE INVESTIGATES VICE PRESIDENT CHENEY'S ROLE AS CHIEF ARCHITECT OF THE WAR ON TERROR AND HIS BATTLE WITH THE DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE FOR CONTROL OF THE "DARK SIDE" FRONTLINE presents THE DARK SIDE Tuesday, June 20, 2006, 9 to 10:30 P.M. ET on PBS

Olympic National Park News Release June 13, 2006 For Immediate Release Barb Maynes 360-565-3005 Olympic National Park Invites Public Review and Comment on Draft General Management Plan The Olympic National Park Draft General Management Plan/Environmental Impact Statement (Draft GMP/EIS) has been released for public review and comment, announced Superintendent Bill Laitner today. The 90-day public comment will begin this Friday, June 16 and continue through September 15, 2006. “This is a long-term, comprehensive plan that sets a course for the park over the next 15 to 20 years,” explained Laitner. “We encourage anyone interested in the future of Olympic National Park to review the plan during the next 90 days and provide us with their thoughts and input.” The Draft GMP/EIS provides extensive information about current conditions in Olympic National Park, including visitor facilities and access, natural and cultural resources and the park’s role within the surrounding region. In addition, the document describes a no-action alternative and three different action alternatives for managing the park, including the National Park Service’s preferred alternative. The environmental impacts of each alternative are also analyzed. The NPS preferred alternative aims to protect natural and cultural resources while improving visitor experiences and was developed using components of the other alternatives and the extensive public input provided earlier in the planning process. Key points of the NPS preferred alternative include: · Access to existing developed areas, along with park trails, campgrounds, and facilities would be kept at approximately their current levels. · Improvements to the downhill ski support facilities at Hurricane Ridge could be made, with no area expansion or increase in use above current (normal year) use levels. · Three boundary adjustments are considered (in the Lake Crescent, Ozette and Queets areas) to better protect watersheds and habitat for wildlife including fish and elk. These may include purchases from willing sellers only and/or possible land exchanges with the U.S. Forest Service and the State of Washington Department of Natural Resources. · Kalaloch Lodge, cabins, and related facilities would be relocated outside the active erosion and channel migration zones and outside the floodplain of Kalaloch Creek. · The visitor information station at Kalaloch would be removed and a multi-agency facility would be constructed to better serve the needs of the visiting public. This facility would feature the coastal marine and cultural resources of the area. · The Hoh Visitor Center may be improved to provide a higher quality visitor experience. · Parkwide policies for wilderness management are proposed, setting the foundation for the Wilderness Management Planning process, now scheduled to begin in late 2007. Even when completed, a GMP does not guarantee funding for implementing the approved plan. Once completed, the plan will provide guidance and a long-term vision for park management and incremental steps will be taken to reach park management goals and objectives. The 400-page draft plan is available in a variety of formats for public review. The Draft GMP/EIS is available online at the National Park Service planning website 1. http://parkplanning.nps.gov.

We've covered this before, but an "overhand" knot (I think it is actually a "double overhand" and it is also called a "water knot") is not the same thing as a "Euro Death Knot." An overhand knot has the tails sticking out opposite ends of the knot and is tied by making a single overhand, then following through with the other rope; the EDK has both tails sticking out the same side of the knot and is tied by taking two ropes and tying a single overhand on both strands. Many of my friends, wary of rappelling on an EDK, are quite happy with the double overhand. EDK Water Knot

Where you say "you believe" the Whitehouse denied it, are you referring to statements like this, from Scott McClellan? Link ? Strong stuff. NOT. "He had 56 out of a required 56 points..." Hmm - the questions remain: did he miss all those drills and refuse or fail to show up for a physical or not? Public documents and virtually all the evidence we've seen make it pretty clear that he enjoyed the privilege that comes with being the son of a powerful man and didn't fulfill because he didn't have to. And the Swifties? Seriously, Fairweather. You are smart enough to know that was crap. Your blind allegience is charming but on any argument over who served our country and who didn't, or who showed bravery and honor and who didn't, you might not want to be so swashbuckling.

Feel free to answer my question, Fairweather. Do you even read the newspapers or do you get everything from Fox and Limbaugh? Did you even know what story the Rather thing delt with - that your commander in chief did not fulfull his service oblitations? Is your post above meant to suggest that there is doubt that he failed to do so?

Miles, Coltrane, Bird, or Monk? Now you'd be talking!

I use to have (maybe still do) some "special" remaster or golden whatever it was of JA's Volunteers, and boy did it suck. It seems to me that with a fair amount of older music and a good turntable, the old vinyl's sound as good or better than the cd's even though they do have dust and scratches on them. By the way: "have you ever loved a woman" and "Key to the Highway"