5 reasons to tie in...

[EWolfe]

5 reasons to tie up a

[catbirdseat]

AlpineK said:

The discussion of clove hitches wasn't related to tying into a rope. You just claimed it was a weak knot.

A knot which which fails at 70% of the rope strength is weaker than one that fails at 85% of the rope strength, but the difference is not necessarily significant, as ropes are very strong, indeed. An anchor tie-in needs to be even stronger than a climber tie-in I am sure you will agree, because it needs to hold the weight of two. You seldom hear of ropes breaking so obviously all the commonly used knots are plenty strong. It is much more common for knots to come untied.

[EWolfe]

cite your sources, or I won't listen to your blither

[AlpineK]

MisterE said:

cite your sources, or I won't listen to your blither

 

Exactly! So cite them CBS...you've earned your way on to my list of untrusted spewers.

[cracked]

He's right. I'm not going to go through the effort to prove it though. I know I'm right, that's enough for me.

 

PS that link to girth-hitch strengths probly has somthing about different knots.

[EWolfe]

cracked said:

He's right. I'm not going to go through the effort to prove it though. I know I'm right, that's enough for me.

 

PS that link to girth-hitch strengths probly has somthing about different knots.

 

And that's drawing on that vast pool of experience, knowledge and research of, what, 3? 4? years Max?

Your blither is no better without COLD HARD FACTS!

 

Let's see 'em people.

 

It is in your hands to prove your knot is stronger, or ours is compromised. I call catBullShit!!

[cracked]

To all the jerk-offs who claim that

 

a. a bowline will not remain attached to you if it is tied incorrectly,

and

b. that a clove hitch is a strong "knot":

 

Tell Lynn Hill that a bowline won't stay attached to a harness if it isn't completely tied. She nearly died because it did.

 

As for a clove hitch, they slip at roughly 1000lbs. So no, it isn't 'strong', per se. But since people only use clove hitches for anchor setups, etc, there is no danger, and if one slips it simply helps equalize the system. I use a figure-8 because it's second nature, I don't have too many problems untying it (200 lbs, shut up), it's bombproof, and easy to inspect.

 

This is SUCH a stupid argument.... On a Friday night, no less....

[EWolfe]

I god a code. Whud's yer eggthcuth ?

[AlpineK]

Dear punk ass beotch,

 

A) Yosemite boline (at the very least) not a regular boline

 

B) Clove hitch slip can be prevented by tying two half hitches to back it up.

[Pencil_Pusher]

I'll throw something into the foray.

I did read something about some SAR deputy sheriff pulling off some tests in the southwest or Utah, on the clove hitch. That 1000lbs sounds like the same number. However, I saw a slide show by Miles Smart where the dude did some sick and twisted route down in South America. These two were simul-aiding to some extent. Anyhow, his buddy took a 110ft whipper on a clove hitch when his first aid piece failed. What's 1000lbs? Something like 5kn? A 110ft factor 1 fall has got to generate more force than that. Maybe there was more to the story, but I feel pretty confident using them (not to tie in with).

I know one person who had a bowline come off while on lead. Not just off, but completely off as in the rope fell to the ground. This person is very safe and level headed. Maybe a contributing factor was the belayer did not know how to check the knot. Most people use the 8 and know how to check it. Like caveman said, use whatever you want, it's your ass.

200 pounders unite!

Edited for math... thankfully no one noticed

Edited October 25, 2003 by Pencil_Pusher

[cracked]

AlpineK said:

Dear punk ass beotch,

 

A) Yosemite boline (at the very least) not a regular boline

WTF is a 'yosemite boline'?

B) Clove hitch slip can be prevented by tying two half hitches to back it up.

 

Only mounties do this.

[AlpineK]

cracked said:

AlpineK said:

Dear punk ass beotch,

 

A) Yosemite boline (at the very least) not a regular boline

WTF is a 'yosemite boline'?

B) Clove hitch slip can be prevented by tying two half hitches to back it up.

 

Only mounties do this.

 

A) you're an idiot if you don't know a yosemite boline

 

B) Tree guys tie clove hitches backed up with two half hitches all the time.

 

I know you weigh a lot, but I shock load logs that weigh more than you all the time and the knot works great.

[cracked]

AlpineK said:

cracked said:

AlpineK said:

Dear punk ass beotch,

 

A) Yosemite boline (at the very least) not a regular boline

WTF is a 'yosemite boline'?

B) Clove hitch slip can be prevented by tying two half hitches to back it up.

 

Only mounties do this.

 

A) you're an idiot if you don't know a yosemite boline

 

B) Tree guys tie clove hitches backed up with two half hitches all the time.

 

I know you weigh a lot, but I shock load logs that weigh more than you all the time and the knot works great. [/quote

Tree guys are mounties!?!?!

 

Whatever, I really don't care. As for you yoboline, do you mean a double bowline? Or a double rewoven bowline? This thread should be taken out and shot.

[EWolfe]

Then there's the Swedish Bowline: bowline ON a clove-hitch. For the super safe, no slippage!

[cracked]

MisterE said:

Then there's the Swedish Bowline: bowline ON a clove-hitch. For the super safe, no slippage!

[AlpineK]

Crack, you've proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are young inexperienced and stupid.

 

Of course that picture of you hangdogging the shit out of an easy ice climb proved that earlier.

[AlpineK]

 

Yosemite Bowline

This knot was sent to me by Bonnie Crystal.

This is a variant of the basic bowline which gets around the problem of the knot loosening itself by taking the end of the rope and threading it back through the knot. This is a neat alternative to using a half-hitch to secure the end of the rope and the resulting knot has the strength of a figure of eight.

 

 

 

source

[EWolfe]

That's a good one K. Thanks for the beta

 

I'll try that next time.

 

[lummox]

try it by doubling the rabbit hole loops and finishing with a double overhand knot (or use a clove hitch through which to pass the tag end). it will loosen btw without something to hold the tag end.

[cracked]

AlpineK said:

Crack, you've proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are young inexperienced and stupid.

 

Of course that picture of you hangdogging the shit out of an easy ice climb proved that earlier.

You jackasses don't know shit about me. And you've just proved it!

[AlpineK]

We've proved how little you know about knots Paul

[EWolfe]

AlpineK said:

We've proved how little you know about knots Paul

 

...and it's Apauling"

[lummox]

5 reasons to tie in with this around your neck:

1). you are suck

2). nobody likes you including you.

3). high insurance rates are driving you crazy. really crazy.

4). those annoying voices in your head tole you to do it that way.

5). it will impress jody foster.

[catbirdseat]

Kurt, the point I was trying to make about the clove hitch is that strength is not an issue. Don't get all excited for nothing.

 

Both the bowline with the Yosemite finish and the rewoven bowline are good knots that will not come untied. I would not hesitate to use either of them myself for safety's sake. They are great if you know how to tie them properly.

 

So here, instead of going from memory, I looked it up.

 

Bowline 63 percent

Clove Hitch 60 percent

Figure Eight Loop 80 percent

 

Sources:

http://www.layhands.com/knots/ and

Boat Crew Seamanship Manual COMDTINST M16114.5B (Feb 27, 1998)

 

I reiterate, all these knots are strong enough.

 

I don't think a single bowline is a good knot, even with a half fisherman as backup. I sometimes use a half fisherman on my figure eights to use up an extra long tail. The half fisherman sometimes comes untied. If the backup knot comes untied the bowline can come untied. (Double fisherman knots, by the way never come untied because the two knots are cinched against one another, something that is difficult to do when a half fisherman is used as a backup knot).

[cracked]

AlpineK said:

We've proved how little you know about knots Paul

How so, Kurt (these real names are so liberating )? The 'yoboline' is a different name for the same knot. I knew the knot, but not the name. Guess that means I'm stupid.