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Thats pretty,Ray I think bolts dont belong EVEYWHERE! I think that is your point? We need to leave some sqare footage of wilderness-wild. There are plenty of climbs for anyone-FB Proves this

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"ground up" would entail getting your feet wet. is it "ground up" if you start from a canoe, and then if the water level goes down you have to go back and do the newly exposed 10 feet, like adding a sit start on to a boulder problem? confused.gif

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