hawkeye69

some of these guys would have you think that climbing mt hood is all serious and sh&&. fact is, if you were experienced and if conditions were good (and if you were experienced youd have an idea on the conditions) the so side of hood is about like hiking a black diamond at a ski area. not a big deal- if you were experienced. the peeps who get in trouble are mostly out of shape, inexperienced and or idiots and very few are accidents involving people who have their sh&& together, particularly on the so side. having said all that cuz you are not experienced you might want to heed some of their advice. if it were me, i probably would take the kid up the south side and ski down. but thats me.

whatever happened to the old days, when these things were resolved man to man instead of through some f&&&ed up thread that got sidetracked.

Say what ever you want…..just make sure your belayer knows what you mean. I suggest covering this before you leave the ground. When I am ready to grab the rope and run it through the carabineer, I have a habit of saying “rope” then I say “clipped” once it is in. When climbing with someone new I try to go over this on the ground. "Rope" has always been the shortened version of pull like hell, the old language for "almost" take. the human mind remembers things that become ingrained, if you meet some dude and tell him what you just said and expect him to reverse lingo that he has used for years as something opposite, you will end up screwing yourself. this is a very stupid thing to try and reverse old meanings.

unfortunately, the most likely response is a ticket for not having your frickin parking pass properly displayed after the theieves stole it........ sorry to hear about this but thanks for the wakeup call.

That is a very good point Ru…..what is the standard for sport climbing? Or more to the point….where? Smith? That is kind of the start of it. I would not say that place has soft and easy sport climbs……a lot of what I have climbed there is ten feet between bolts. Thats probably because many of those were done in the 80's when even rapp bolters wanted to maintain a sense of adventure...sorry

i agree with everything you said here pope. having learned in the 70's at a granite slab area, that was where i cut my teeth. back then we didnt have R/X ratings and it was kind of strange to see in modern guides many of the routes i put up with those R/X ratings. back then we just kind of assumed that was climbing. i climbed myself into many places where death was a real possibility, such is the folly of youth, but that was how it was done. not sprayin here thats just how it was. however, i also rapp bolted when that got all started too. the importance to me is realizing that they can coexist. sure its tough, but there are places where they do. the fine line i called you on earlier was placing a bolt for future climbers. i have first hand experience with that from 20 years ago. having received crap from climbers with lesser experience about runout routes, i put up a moderate sport route and conciously placed more bolts than i would have normally. to me, rapping and drilling is a different beast altogether and when one chooses to do so, they have an obligation to make it safe (at least i think so). because compared to ground-up FA's its cheating. (but its damn fun and i like it too). on this particular route one of america's greatest most heralded hard men took offense and yanked the first bolt on that route. (frequently the first bolt is very important but you all know that cuz it aint falling that hurts you its the ground). i didnt really give a sh&&, but in discussions with this guy his die hard traditional (god i hate that word) stance was that you should only place a bolt for yourself, not for others. i tend to agree with him for traditional (that word sucks) ground up routes. now many of these routes may not be for the masses. but its all fair. its fair cuz if you start not knowing whats up there on the FA then its a level playing field. in fact, its damn tuff for the FA team cuz they are casting off into the unknown, while the parties to follow will be told explicitly, via the internet and guidebooks what the hell is up there and whether you can die or not. at least thats my take on the whole thing. but there is that fine line of deciding to add bolts for future climbers. thats what you were saying you did on some route you were talking about earlier up thread before we got sidetracked on whose mama was doin who and whether we ought to post our real names. when you conciously decide to add a bolt for future climbers, you enter a mind set closer to sport climbing than the minimum impact philosophy of "traditional" (did i say i hate that word?) ground up ascents. personally, i think its all good. i hate the idea of climbing being sanitized so that everything is safe. i also hate the idea that there is only one right way to climb. and god knows, when most of runout routes were put up, many of us had no idea how popular climbing would be, and that the rock resource that is finite would be so "used". sport climbing has allowed all sorts of choss piles to be climbable in a safe fashion. i think thats predominantly a good thing and yet i do believe that not all rock needs to be climbed. i am glad that there are guys like you out there bitchin about this as a reminder to to those who learned as sport climbers first. just to remind climbers that there is a different way. but your "all or none" posts do get a little tiring. alas, without the likes of you we might all be a touchy-feely bunch with nothing else to do but pat each other on the butts when a good tr is posted....

what about laps? or multiple "routes"? surely there is some credit for that stuff.

your post makes me glad i poched a camp site at lake louise for a record 5 nights last time i was there. hot showers included. no stinkin entry and no stinkin cg fee. the merican way i tell ya. eh?

pope, the problem with you is that you are claiming to have put in a bolt on a route for people other than yourself to make it safe. extrapolate that and you gots sport climbing. too bad you cant see through your own shit to know that.

sounds like CAG has issues. the guy had issues trying to give them his business. i mean he was willing to wade thorugh their online res system. then CAG takes money. then CAG cancels course. then CAG keeps money. all you "nice" folks out there wouldnt be just a little bit pissed off? i would be. at that point i would be very pissed off. this guy at least gives the guides credit. just says their front office sucks. if the business does not have their systems operational in a way that works for customers, customers will go spend their money elsewhere. these days guides are a dime a dozen. good guides are fewer but still, if the freaking company cant live up to their obligation then screw them...

pretty funny. so pope has placed bolts near cracks but totally bitches about others? Observation: its pretty easy to justify how your own bolts are great and others suck. this is not a unique situation to the cascades, it happens everywhere. "i know i crapped my pants but that kid next to me smells worse than i do" wahhhh

the new mediaum grade huh? i think someone else mentioned something about HOW you climb it. the problem with simply looking at the number is that it is a very limiting factor and does nothing to indicate (shall we say) other environmental factors. i aint talking about heat, sweat or humidity. what i am talking about is the ability to balls to the wall actually climb something in the R/X range. me, i am proud to say that i was a damn solid 5.10 climber. what that means to me is that i didnt fall on 5.10 for about 12 years and on site soloed sometimes at that grade. yep, sub-moderate by your standards, but i wonder how many of these gymbo's can actually climb near their best on-site ability when the chips are down (ie: no frickin pro on a big fricking wall with serious consequences of a fall and no bolts in site?) sorry, but what you are talking about is impressive to me but it is severely limiting and is a different sport than the one that i practiced for many years. i could be kind of biased since i sucked at the high numbers because the best i ever on-sited was 12b and best i ever red-pointed was 12b. but if there was a 10 off-width or whatever with limited pro, give me the rope and i am game. i am damn proud to call myself a mediocre 5.10 climber under those standards. just recognize that it is a different game than the all out quest for numbers. i apologize for the spray but wanted to throw out a a different viewpoint....

post pics of your climber babe/tent mate so we can question your judgement...

well at least some things are a constant here. an annual IB slugfest, and the thread degeneration...thats why i like this site. joe, i wish you success on your ascent of whatever line you climb there.

nice read. thanks. it is truly a magnificant place. joe you should go there and do the Scenic Cruise, great route. its really called PEG-MY-FRITE...