Thinker

for ever and ever, amen....

yetti on steroids: http://meph.eu.org/

Al, it sounded to me like there were dozens of CRTs up there, though it may have just been my take on the article. It is expensive. Common options include: covering the contaminated soil with soil, rock, impermeable liners, and/or a clay layer; excavating the contaminated soils and trucking them to a haz waste landfill. I've seen modified sand and gravel sorting/washing machines used to separate the lead from the soil, though the fragmented particles are difficult to remove. In some cases, I've seen the soil put in 'temporary' storage cells on site. I've also seen lead contaminated soils used as roadbase (underneath paving), though this is a less than desireable solution (and maybe not legal.) In any case, it IS expensive....and fraught with legal rammifications.

question this:

Alasdair's right. While rounds can fragment into small particles and be transported to streams when it rains and during snowmelt, the main risk is to humans eating or breathing the dirt/dust in the area. I've done some background studies and sampling at several old military firing ranges and rarely find much off-site migration of lead. PAH's are common contaminants related to some clay pigeons, and they will migrate more easily than lead. The mercury in the CRTs (computer monitors and televisions) would concern me a bit, too.

for what it's worth, I use a zero degree bag on Rainier, but I've climbed in Aug and Sept and spent a few nights at the summit. I sleep a little cold and really appreciate the extra luxury; I got really tired of being cold in my 20 degree bag.

Ode to Trask (adapted from the original by Patriot Aitch) I had a vision of a far off world Where avatars of snaffles ran among the dusty streets And plagued the gentle townsfolk With their cruel pillage. It seemed this dark eternal scourge Had thrust upon the race of men, From bushd and tufted fleet of foot, Deceiving in their guile. The deep despair befallen all mankind Was meted out by buccaneering rats, With bushy tails, that swarmed across A once benign and fertile land. Nightmare gorgons feared of nought, The canopy of trees would echo With their hideous calls, and scratchings Would announce their awesome spectre. Until a shaft of light sprang from The dust of human desolation, A call of such enchanting clarity Rise up and shed the yoke of tyranny! A silver paladin named Trask, halod, and with glowing lance Points to the grey demonic horde That shackled all through larceny and peril, Deliverance is our gift to future souls The cry to arms rang out above the battlefield. The sciurine chatter from a thousand furry mouths fell silent then became a wild demonic roar, A tide of raucous rodents forward surged. The champion was torn from steed, His limbs rent from his trunk and cast away, Among his hopeless calls for rescue and his sobs of agony, A prayer for quick and sudden death. The once enheartened throng that rose In answer to his words of freedom, Threw down their swords and fled back to their havens, In terror hid and wept, held children close. My reverie disconsolate as understanding comes. This was no far off world but here! Utopia destroyed! The evil vanquished not and twice as bad, And now some idolise the rodent canker. The sun sets on this saddened world where, Held to ransom by the bushy hordes, In dismal, sombre, melancholy rule, Mankind in hiding still awaits salvation.

there have been a couple of times I've been able to put Kevin into a 'shifting' orbit that circles the planet(s) a number of times and eventually hits the target. Huge scores then!...and cool spirograph-like graphics.

I'm not sure this is always true. The last thing I'd want to see is for an individual going out to 'fix' what they perceive as a problem without a wider discussion with the local climbing community in general and some consensus. Certainly participating in this type of discussion, contributing resources (time AND money), and maintaining a health community are all important factors in this issue. But maybe an online forum (or at least THIS online forum) is not the place for this discussion. I suspect that such communities exist in most regions. I'd bet that route developers in the Leavenworth area, for example, let each other know if they see something that looks excessively bolted, squeezed in too close to another route, trivial, contrived, chipped, or anything else. Hopefully they complement each other on jobs well done, too. (note: both bolted and trad routes included in above commentary.) In my opinion, it's a shame that there's not at least one cc.com forum that is able to maintain an environment conducive to healthy discussions about the these issues. There ARE obviously some developers who post here, but there are also obvious and significant missing persons.

Alondro misses trask too: web page Date: 03/08/2003 From: ALONDRA Poem by Alondra written December 3, 2003 (the first and third stanzas were written by Mike.) ODE TO TRASK If the Lord God had sent me Then the witch would fall She'd be gone and I would be NOT inside this wall! But because I am an evil man, A sanctimonious prig, When Barnabas walled me up Everyone danced a jig. But all that dancing hurt his head And made him want to scream So he came back from the dead To haunt the dancer's dream. He wanted his revenge, So he took morter and brick He walled up Barnabas and hoped That would do the trick. But Josette's ghost saw him And let Julia and Willie know That Barnabas was in the wall To him they had to go. Willie removed all the bricks As Julia stood by Then Barnabas said with great relief "I thought I was gonna die!" This is the tale of what happened To one "Reverend" Trask. If you want more of my sorry poetry All you have to do is ask!" But no one in their right mind will! ROTFL!!!

I have a jacket made of Schoeller WB-400 that I wore bird hunting once this year. As luck would have it, I got stuck in a huge patch of blackberry brambles. The jacket got about 10 snags that I was kinda upset about. I streched and cut the snags and they've been fine since. I don't even notice them anymore.

What? Drilling on Mars? Have we already reached critical mass with the bolting that goes on here? That happened faster than I would have predicted. Mentioning Mars, maybe one of our long-haired readers could help this guy out: It looks like Pope is better connected that we thought: yahoo news "NASA last heard from Spirit as it prepared to continue its work examining its first rock, just a few yards from its lander. "

be aware that footbeds may change the way your boots fit....that was my experience. I bought Sole Orthotics, which slightly raised my feet in the boots, causing irritation to my heels. They also pushed my feet slightly forward, causing problems with the big toenails. Other than that, they feel great. My knees stopped hurting instantly. I think it's best to get the custom footbeds at the same time you get new boots to make sure they will work well together.

Maybe it's Minx...

practice makes perfect

I must be a little dense today. So what's the alternative to alternating if you're not considering clipping both pieces into one piece of gear? Would it be cliping the same rope to the pro 2 or 3 (or more) times in a row? That makes it sound like you're just trailing the 2nd rope at that point, given the non-wandering nature of the route you described in your initial post.

Yes. Some of it depends on the situation you're in, like everything else in climbing. My answer is certainly not comprehensive, but it's a start. Clipping both ropes into a single piece of gear increases the maximum force on the piece, but reduces the distance of the fall. So, unless you're risking a groundfall due to rope stretch, I'd only clip one at a time....unless you have a bomber piece to clip.

OK. There's one data point.

are chics or dudes?

what kind of boots?

and the illustrious Dryad!

cc.com pushing the limits of thinking.......

Richard Noggin raised a good question in this thread, something we talked about at Pub Club last week too. Does all the spray here at cc.com turn off climbers developing new rock routes? Are we missing out on opportunities to know about these routes because these folks get hammered every time they post? Any constructive ideas about how to warm them back up to this site? I sure hate to see the majority of PacNW climbers lose out on this info based on the actions of a few loud mouths.

Why limit it to Christianity? Religion (in general) and science are not incompatible....but what's that worth? Scientific theories can usually be tested and eventually proven, revised, or discarded. I'm not aware of any way to 'test' religious ideas. Why even compare the two?