sk

I am getting your point PP, I just don't realy agree with it. If say Texplorer and I were climbing together and he told me he could solo something I would be inclined to believe him and trust that he is going to take care of himself and do what is within his ability. I get that when we climb with others we should be able to be honest and up front with them about how we are feeling... but I do not think that MY feelings or YOUR feelings should rule the universe... If feelings ruled, I would have to give up climbing alltogether because frankly it scares the shit out of my mother... and I love her alot.

I have seen some one fall, before I ever started climbing. And you are right it is awful... and it was someone I cared about and it was the worst sound I have ever heard, he was lucky and was totaly fine. but on the other hand...NO one can know if someone else is capable of a climb. SOLOING is about the individual experience.

quote: Originally posted by Peter Puget: My soloing example was only to show how I view my responsibilty to the "unknown" other. Dru - Sometimes and in some areas soloing just isn't proper. Sk - Not sure what your post was replying to. The person I advised not to solo was a friend climbing with me at the time the advice was given. Let me add that I have soled a bit myself and I would and have chosen to do so in a manner that conforms to the advice I gave to my friend. Having seen a crumpled body at the base of a cliff I know some of the effects. You're right I know little about you. But I do know you seem to think it proper to solo a route after someone has expressed discomfort with you doing so. Simply put to solo so trivial or not so trivial route if I was causing distress to others is something I would not choose to do. This would be especially true if the route in question was something I had "dialed'. PP I guess I am just wondering what makes you think you get to tell any one what they should or should not do....? I don't mean to be a bitch but realy? I don't free solo, but I know someone who does.. I have never feared for my safety while he was on the rock and often let him climb threw as we change shoes or take a break when on top rope with others. HE DOES NOT SCARE ME. It is the ass hole who can't give a good belay or make a safe anchor that scares me. The free solo guy will probably only kill himself... that is his choice... and his to make.

quote: Originally posted by iain: Do you try to talk to people near you who you believe are belaying poorly, etc? I could see running into some static if I tried to do that at smith dihedrals, for instance. Takes some political skill! I have tried in the past, and probably will again if I see something so awful I just can't help myself but it is challenging I wish I could show you a picture of what thease guys were doing. BTW I am advocating FREE WILL, not free soloing.

I agree. But I don't think that the crag is a place to have a fist fight over who is doing what. I have asked people to NOT belay across the whole area so they can sit on a stupid bench... but I can't make them stop... well maybe I could if I was Cavey

there has to be a balance somewhere between being helpful...ie. advising a less experienced climber... and being a noisey pain in the ass. Many people free solo at our local... it's not high and there are easy 2nd and 3rd class scrambles to the left of the 5th class climbing... I have seen someone fall about 30 feet, bounce twice and walk away. I can usualy tell as someone walks up to the crag if they know what the fuck they are doing or not. if they don't I just make sure I know where the nearest phone is so that I can call for help when the time comes. I can sugest that some one not climb... but it never works... I would be upset if some one tried to tell me not to free solo something that I have worked for a long time on and have totaly dialed... what do you know about me???? TG should talk from his experience... as others should speak from their own... we can be concerned about our fellow climbers with out being the fricking secret police... or the mommy patrole.

weather you come to 11worth or not... as long as we are all having a good time I will find you at SMITH in NOVEMBER

It seems to me that having a site disclaimer might be a good idea leagaly for jon and tim... but we are all individuals. although there are climbers that claim to be more experienced no one has there resume' posted and is claiming to be this sites expert on any given subject. we are just individuals telling other individuals what works for us.... I have learned alot here and I would hate for anyone especialy the more experienced climbers to "watch" what they say for fear that an inexperienced climber will get hurt. just because you, TG, and the likes are perponantes of free soloing and solo mountain trips.... doesn't mean that my first outing into the mountains ought to be solo...hopefuly we as a group are smarter than that. In addition to that, it is rare that some one asking a legitamate question about gear or how to do something, gets only one answer... so because we are all on here all day we are looking out for eachother. With the thred about fear there were many options choices and ideas for the person to pick threw and use or not use depending on experience and personal style. [ 09-24-2002, 09:30 AM: Message edited by: sk ]

Good 'cause Oregon should "represent"

every one fly a cc.com flag or something... so we can pick our brothers and sisters out of the crowd

well ummm everyone except you

nope... not what I had in mind... I just mean that he is being overly exacting and he is picking on me (whaaaaaaa)

okay then... Why ask what? DFA is a nudge

quote: Originally posted by allison: I would like to weigh in that Tom Robbins blows goats. Pluse he doesn't write good female characters, and the only guy who can get away with that is that genius pig, David Mamet. Just goes to show HOW diffrent people are. I STRONGLY related to Robins female characters... when I was younger and now too. I Love that the most about him. He writes about women LIKE ME. I even asked Jk to read his books in the beginning so that he could better understand me... He learned to enjoy the books for his own reasons. "there are no wierd people, just some people need more understanding than others" -Another Roadside Attraction

quote: Originally posted by Mr. Natural: what's with all the unbridled creativity today, did somebody dose you lattes or something? Why ask why?

too bad

quote: Originally posted by erik: i got something for someone who asked for the thing in return for the other thing which will be there too, but only after 3 maybe 9. but that will be determinded by the other one in the place where it happend last week. christ I hope this secret message is not for me, cause I didnot understand a word you said FERN_ come down!!! It should be fun

saw the photo you were right!!!!! party on

how many cc.comers are realy going to be arround??? maybe we should have a pre rope up rope up and use the group cam ground thig so we don't have to quiet??????? any thoughts??/ who can set that up???

NO WAY!!!! then we would have to give you up to some rich bitch that hasn't spent all her money on climbing gear think how unhappy you would be [ 09-23-2002, 10:51 AM: Message edited by: sk ]

quote: Originally posted by Gordonb: We will be there with at least 3 families and various singles. We should have a plate at the entrance with the camp numbers of the CC.com groups. That way we can troll for who brought the best beer. we will be trucking in after midnight on friday keep a light on for us

come on dru you can do better than that. It's not like we are going to hog tie you and marry you to someone when you are all drunk and shit ohh oops... maybe I just gave it away strike that last comment

had a little tiny bit of fun. kid stiff saterday ...on sunday got up at 6 am and climed at local crag. got 5 routes in before I had to be home ...hung out wiht some friends and got to see some mouth watering pics of THE VALLEY alll in good time...all in good time

a start for sure

you better be there then, cause anna always has the PBR