gzack

Hey all, Trying to figure out the feasibility of climbing at the City this time of year. Never been. Any particularly good areas to soak up the sun/be sheltered from the wind? I'd like to target cracks, 5.8 and under. Hope they aren't filled with ice!

Thanks for the pics Topher! Since there is ample protection to be had there, may as well leave the anchor afterall.

A micro-cam right off the belay, yikes! Then again, I would wager that the majority of people climbing that route are gonna aid through that section regardless of what pro is there. It's been a while, but isn't there an area of that crack (near where the pin was) that constricts to a pinch? How about threading a short length of 7 or 8mm cord through there and tying a loop as fixed pro? Or we could just chop the anchor (or take the hangers off for a trial-run) to keep people from going that far left, and encourage the use of the more moderate (thus consistent with the rest of the route) crack to its right.

I heard that it was the first pin above the anchor atop the column, and if I recall correctly, that pin was previously identified on this forum (Joseph?) as one of the worst out at Beacon. A short mini-angle.

Does anyone have any info that they would like to share with regards to the rumors of a fall on Right Gull last week that resulted in one of the pins pulling?

Wow! If those bolts are that old, that is amazing that they look that good (at least on the outside). Almost unbelievable.

Ivan: What I was asking is why do some of those 1/4" bolts in the pictures look brand new (no rust)? I have heard of a bird or two that still places 1/4" bolts (in remote areas, if they are hand drilling), but usually associate 1/4" bolts with antiquity. Is this a case of the former? How old are they?

I've never been on this route, but why do most of those 1/4" bolts in the pictures look so new?

Here's a unique perspective of the cliff:

A gear question for the more seasoned Beacon climbers: What are your favorite micro-nuts for Beacon? I've no experience with gear that small, but am looking to possibly pick some up for my next conquests out there (harder, thinner). BD Micro's, DMM IMP, Peanuts, or Micro Wallnuts??? What seems to work best in your experience?

Thanks for the offer of access to the pin inventory Joe. I'm still not sure where I stand in the whole debate of what to do when a crucial pin has gone bad though (new pin, or much more permanent SS b@%# ?). BTW, what is that pin at the crux of the third pitch of Warriors (in the short dihedral) ? I forgot my hammer today, and I believe it is a knifeblade? Really rusty too. Did you say that nearly all the old knifeblades out there were worthless? With regards to Micah's discussion on the longevity of SS: I work in the water-well industry, and every so often we have to pull a 20-30 year old pump out of the bottom of a well. The 1" galvanized water pipe that runs from it to the surface (80-400' typically), can be horribly rusted and pitted (not just due to galvanic reactions where it runs into the SS pump), while the SS of the pump body looks almost new (sometimes some minor grey-ish patina). Much of this steel is just thin panels around the outside of the pump, too. Granted, I can't say what grade of SS it is, and meteoric water is usually more acidic and richer in dissolved oxygen than ground water, but seeing the contrast between the SS and non-SS in the same environment (constantly submerged) is eye-opening. Disclaimer: I'm not a metallurgist.

Thanks Joe, good info and thanks for the opinion on SS vs. Ti. Speaking of checking the fixed pro out there, I inspected the pins on the first pitch of Blownout yesterday. The upper two seem solid and had a nice ring to them right off the bat. The first pin, however, was able to be driven in another 1/2", and never started to ring, probably because it is in some broken rock. Consider it questionable. I also was able to remove the fixed alien (between the first and second pins) and free up a .3 cam placement there.

Joe, when you say that the pins have out-lasted the bolts out there, exactly what type/era of bolt are we talking? Plated 3/8" 5-pieces from the 90's? Opdycke-vintage plated 3/8" studs? Did you ever see a stainless bolt that was in worse shape than a pin? Are you arguing against replacing certain questionable pins with modern stainless bolts because of the poor performance (per your observations) of the inferior bolts used in the past? Thanks for sharing what you have learned out there.

Did you lose a cam on Dod's Jam at Beacon Rock on Saturday the 15th? We were the party starting up just after you guys had reached the ground, and figure it must have been yours. Call me with the brand, size, personal identifications, and location on the route of the cam, and I would love to get it back to you. - George, 360.904.7694

I just want it on the record that I never said the word "bolt" for the Dutchman. Since I am on the record now, here is my bit: Firstly, I appreciate Beacon as the refuge for trad climbing that it is, and would like to see it stay that way (that is why I am asking if it can be reasonably lead on gear, sans pins). However, I believe that if fixed protection does exist on a route, then it should be able to perform its function (stop a lead fall). That is presumably why the FA placed that protection in the first place... That being said, pins are great! For a first ascent!... To insist that climbers 10, 20, 30 years after the FA continue to rely on those same pieces is IMO unreasonable, because pins obviously aren't reliable long-term fixed protection (especially in our climate). Additionally, I am not persuaded to leave obviously shitty fixed protection on a route by the argument, "I climb it all the time the way it is..." Unless you have tested (fallen on) the piece, this is not a reasonable argument. If you choose to free-solo a route, or clip obviously useless protection on a route well below your limit, then good for you, but you don't get to then belittle those who ARE climbing at their limit, and who would like the fixed-pro to actually work if needed. What happens to climbing access at Beacon when someone new to the place gets seriously hurt or killed because they made the mistake of trusting the fixed protection on a route?