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b_free

Alpine Ice Tools - Ergo vs. Nomic or other?

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Hi all - newbie here.

 

I saw the article on ice tools on the front page but wondering if people can weigh in an ice tool like the Ergo vs. one like the Nomic / BD Cobra.

 

My understanding is that a tool like the Ergo is more for vertical waterfall ice but the Nomic is more for alpine terrain and perhaps more versatile. Is that accurate? (I'm just using the Petzl brand tools for lumping them in categories)

 

I'm looking for a set that is better for steep alpine routes instead of vertical waterfall ice. Maybe there isn't much of a difference but I'm curious to get some more insight. thanks for your input!

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The Ergo excels at overhanging drytooling, horizontal roofs and crazily featured ice. Not so much when things are below 90-degrees.

 

The Nomic is an excellent all-around tool on everything from easy ice to hard mixed. You can even pound pins with them.

 

I haven't used the Quark enough to comment.

 

The Fusions are nice on rock, but their pick angle makes them literally bounce out of the ice. Mixed performance somewhere between the Nomic and Ergo. (i.e. better than one, worse than the other.)

 

Cobras are great ice tools, and decent on moderate rock, but aren't aggressive enough for serious mixed.

 

Imo, the Viper sucks at everything.

 

Quantum Tech is another phenomenal ice tool that is decent on rock. Very light, though, and quite adept at piolet canne despite the large pinky pommel.

 

It all really comes down to a) how many pairs you can/want to own and b) what your primary use is. If I were to have one pair of tools it'd be the Nomics with Ice picks and CT hammers.

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Take a good look at DMM's line. I've used the DMM Rebel for several years, and it's hands down the most versatile alpine tool I've seen - a functional waterfall/mixed tool that you could actually use for a boot-axe belay if you had to. Most versatile grip I've seen on any tool...

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DMM? Innovative manufacturing on the Rebel. But unless I am mistaken (easily possible) the Rebel has been discontinued. Seems once they decided to simply copy the Nomic and Quark it just took them longer than BD. EMS close outs and Ebay seems to be the only souce now in NA.

 

Even Bullock caved for the newest DMM tools.

 

 

 

Nomic is a versatile tool and I use it in the alpine but I wouldn't call it a "versatile alpine" tool. Ergo may be even less so. But I haven't found it so really. The Cobra and Quark are actually the real versatile alpine tools. DMM Rebel would fit that catagory as well. Petzl has by far the better pick. You gain some on hard technical ground imo by not having such a versatile toolby simply being able to climb faster.

 

I'm not the only one who thinks so it seems.

 

http://coldthistle.blogspot.com/2012/10/modern-mixed.html

 

Past that what the "photo guy" said pretty much covers it.

 

Likely more than you'll ever want to know about tools here:

 

http://coldthistle.blogspot.com/search?q=ergo

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DMM? Innovative manufacturing on the Rebel. But unless I am mistaken (easily possible) the Rebel has been discontinued. Seems once they decided to simply copy the Nomic and Quark it just took them longer than BD. EMS close outs and Ebay seems to be the only souce now in NA.

 

You are correct Dane, both the the Rebel (and it's sibling Anarchist) are no longer on the DMM website. Backcountry Gear is still listing the Rebel axe and hammer on their website if someone is looking.

 

Great tools, love my pair!

 

Jim

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Hey b free, maybe you need to define what steep alpine ice means to you? The definition can range anything from 20 deg snow to 45 deg ice faces to 70 deg gulley ice. IMO, those three scenarios would use three different tools ranging from 60cm straight shaft to something like the grivel alp wing to the nomic respectively.

 

Sure the nomic could do all three but I think it is not best suited to all three. Just my opinion.

 

On 30deg ice, I don't like the reverse curve picks but classic curve picks work great. With that, a tool that offers a classic or a reverse curve pick would be nice. (BD)

for the shaft on alpine ground, I prefer a straight shaft near the spike and the curve near the top, like most ice tools are now. But I like the simple grip area for when it needs to be plunged into snow. So yeah the grip area doesn't have a pommel, but I am a leash wearing fool anyway. take your pick when it comes to leashes and grip pommels.

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Thanks all, this is great. Looks like I should be searching for some quarks/cobras/nomics/rebels. Time to hit the Yard Sale!

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Thanks all, this is great. Looks like I should be searching for some quarks/cobras/nomics/rebels. Time to hit the Yard Sale!

 

Or Quantum Techs

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