ADKMan Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I will be climbing Mt. Rainier via the Emmons route in mid July. Unfortunately one of our party had a change in plans so we will be an unguided 2 person rope team (we're comfortable with our skills and ability). Here is a visual gear list of what I plan to take (obviuosly this represents only the "major" items) what are your thoughts regarding my choices? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Water Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 nice gear gaiters? ...sleep warm? (ridgerest 3/4ths..plan on pack underfoot?) two nanos works, saves weight to wear both vs a heavy one + light one.. assuming not too bulky/hows the layering? i don't have a ton of glacier/crevasse rescue background, so I try to get out and practice, which has continually lead me to the conclusion that crevasse rescue on a two person team can really be a feat to execute unless you've really got your system down and are proficient/excel with CR in a general sense. not meant as an attack just a food for thought if you're able to pick up a 3rd. which dovetails a bit into the beal rando 8mm... not sure what system you have but the skinnier and (new?) rope can lack friction in some belay devices/oft with the appropriate sized prussik for rope dia. can get pulled into pully without tending or a bachmann knot. again realize you'll be on a heavily traveled route and but stuff to make sure is covered for 'just in case' since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 which dovetails a bit into the beal rando 8mm... not sure what system you have but the skinnier and (new?) rope can lack friction in some belay devices/oft with the appropriate sized prussik for rope dia. can get pulled into pully without tending or a bachmann knot. Pulleys in general - yes. But a prusik-minding pulley will generally have less problems with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADKMan Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) Thanks Water, I have the 8mm Beal, my partner has a 60M 9mm rope that he will probably cut in half and we'll most likely bring both. This gives us some additional options in case of a CR becoming necessary. If we find a qualified 3rd person to travel with us this might change the rope details. I don't think I need the gaiters with my boots (I actually stay drier without them). Yes, I am a fairly warm sleeper. I have a MH Phantom 32 also and I have thought about using that instead of the 15 (along with the Nano Puff(s)) Edited March 22, 2012 by ADKMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Water Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 which dovetails a bit into the beal rando 8mm... not sure what system you have but the skinnier and (new?) rope can lack friction in some belay devices/oft with the appropriate sized prussik for rope dia. can get pulled into pully without tending or a bachmann knot. Pulleys in general - yes. But a prusik-minding pulley will generally have less problems with this. KaskadskyjKozak... I say this because I do have a prusik-minding pully and have this issue with an 8mm rope.. it 'almost' works, 'most' of the time. i know there is variable on the pully, prussik diameter, etc.. mine minds it sometimes, but within the space of any time i'm practicing with the 8mm rope it sucks it up in at least once. ADK: ahh my lack of attention to detail on the boots, yes no gaiter makes sense. Yes you can probably do fine with the 32 bag and wearing a nano and throwing the other by the feet. I've also taken my rain shell and snow pants and other items that can be 'flattened' and throw them under my sleeping pad for more insulation--gets the job done. sounds like you're accounting well for CR with the extra rope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I would personally drop the Nano pullover and the MH epic shells and would opt for the 32 degree bag. But I run pathologically hot. I would also consider a light pair of polypro liner gloves and drop one of the warmer pairs of gloves. Overall, some really good choices for a kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obwan Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Looks like you might add a few carabiners and some slings/webbing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromage Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 There are some great pieces of gear you have selected, although generally speaking I think it's too much stuff to bring. From personal experience on multiple ascents of Rainier, between guiding and personal trips, pack weight is one of the biggest factors affecting summit chances. I refined my gear selection to fit all I need into a 55-liter backpack with a total weight (excluding water) of 32 pounds. This includes a share of team gear (tent, picket, food, fuel, etc.). Climbing the Emmons is more than 10,000 feet of gain from the trailhead. Plus the linear distance traveled is longer than the Muir side. A couple pounds of weight can make a big difference over that distance and elevation. If it was my pack to carry I'd ditch the mittens, trekking poles, ice screw, hardshell jacket & pants, and second rope. This list will shave at least ten pounds off your pack weight. Even in July it can feel effing cold above 13K, especially if the sun's not up yet. I bring a Feathered Friends Hooded Helios down jacket for insulation. Plus, if Camp Schurman is still snowbound having a warmer jacket is preferable if you aren't camping on dirt. Look at the weather forecast: if high pressure is in the cards, no need for rain gear. A good softshell jacket & pants will provide sufficient wind protection and are more versatile. Good luck, have fun, climb safely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanO Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Looks like a pretty good list! As far as changes: Bring the 32 degree bag and wear your clothes to bed. What about glacier glasses? I would bring the mitts, or switch your gear setup to a heavy fingered ski glove and a separate pair of fleece gloves. Would also bring the second nano puff. Rainier can get really cold. I also think you could probably fit all of that into a Cilo 45L pack. My whole Rainier kit including tent and stove fits in my 45. The 45 makes a good summit pack too, whereas you're really going to have to strap down the 60L. FYI, two-man crevasse rescue is going to be pretty difficult if not impossible; would recommend a 3 person team. My two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADKMan Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 All good feedback. It sounds like the 32 bag should work, I'll switch a glove out for a liner and make a trailhead decision about the shells. I have the 60L pack but if I can fit everything in a 45L I will give that some thought. Another way to save some ounces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanO Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I have the 60L pack but if I can fit everything in a 45L I will give tha some thought. Another way to save some ounces. If you have the 60L, then definitely just bring that. I think maxed out it only weighs a few more ounces than the 45L. Just make sure you take off all the extra straps, framesheet, and brain on summit day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldfinger Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Watcha bringin' for crevasse escape/rescue? Both of you know how to use it or just you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spionin Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 i made a complete gear list after our trip up lib ridge on july of 2010. i don't run particularly warm, and was very happy with all the gear i brought. i opted for hardshell layers (both top and bottom) b/c of multiple days on the mountain. not only did they weigh less, but there was never any concern about having to dry stuff. hope this helps! https://viewer.zoho.com/docs/bdv7A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckaroo Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I wouldn't trim anything from your initial list (except maybe the extra rope). Especially not the mits. That's just safety margin on a big mountain. Especially if there's an injury. Ski poles you are using on approach and leaving at high camp. Also you are going to be leaving your bag/tent at camp so weight shouldn't be a problem on the climb. I would do the 45L pack though, just get some sil compression stuff sacks to get it all in and tie the rope to the top. the only thing on your gear list that's questionable is the BD SS cramps, known for cracking/breaking, some more of them broke this ice season. Probably a really slim chance but people have died on the Emmons due to crampon problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADKMan Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 My partner actually has more experience in CR (he has been to Alaska twice on guided trips) we are spending quite a bit of time focusing on that aspect during our training process. Again, we still hope to pick up a 3rd experienced climber before the trip. I wasn't aware of the BD SS crampon issue. Is it a general failure or a failure of a specific part? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonG Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Maybe you are already planning on being flexible with the exact dates, but teams coming from out of state often press upwards with a bad/so-so forecast. More important than any gear is going when the weather is stable. Also taking three days instead of two will make it much more enjoyable (and maybe successful considering you will be better acclimated). But maybe you already know all of this, by your gear choices you don't need a lot of help on that end from us. Have a good trip! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldfinger Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Don't worry about the 'pons, you're snow walking, not doing WI6, just make sure you know how to place anchors, self arrest, ascend ropes, and set up z hauls. After winter in the Daks, you're more than ready for the other parts of Rainier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADKMan Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 You guys are great. I really appreciate all of the constructive feedback. Although we don't really have a flexible schedule we are planning 3-4 days to give us better options once we're on the mountain. We also feel strongly about not having a "summit at all costs" attitude. If the conditions are not right we will turn around and try again in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonG Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Given the early summer time of your climb, AL crampons could save you a pound, depending on which exact models you are talking about. For summertime glacier slogging around here I never bring steel, even on Rainier unless I am going for a steeper route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADKMan Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 I've actually considered aluminum crampons but they wouldn't be too useful for my regular climbing in the Adirondacks. If I get to a point where I need to shave that final pound and I have an extra $100 laying around I'll probably go in that direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanO Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Given the early summer time of your climb, AL crampons could save you a pound, depending on which exact models you are talking about. For summertime glacier slogging around here I never bring steel, even on Rainier unless I am going for a steeper route. Jason, would you bring steel on the DC in mid-late summer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScaredSilly Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Dump the googles and about half your clothes. As for gloves, light/mid weight windstopper, heavier weight liners, and shells. One comment on the ski poles - take one on your summit day. Ice axe on the up hill side and pole on the down hill to push yourself up - can be very efficient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 We're headed for a huge snowpack this year, which means that you won't have to do too much crevasse hopping and that will speed your ascent. If you're reasonably fit and the weather is good two days is pretty reasonable. Good water management is another way to control weight. Some people will cut the bottom off their toothbrush to save half an ounce and then carry 2L of water as they hike along creeks. Don't be penny wise and pound foolish. Super hydrate down low and then don't carry more than a liter per person up to camp. Manage your layers, sun exposure, pace etc to keep from getting dehydrated. Traveling in the cooler morning hours will be less work and require less water. Of course, on summit day you'll start in the dark and be down by early afternoon anyway. Non-drug tips to avoid getting a slitting altitude headache: stay really well hydrated, use plenty of sunblock (50+), and wear a hat and polarized sunglasses. You'll do great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genepires Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 2 person rope team with a 30 m rope can be really hard to do crevasse rescue. If you freind is going to cut up his 60m rope, have him cut it down to 50m or 45m. Any less and the spacing is too close between the two of you. (assuming you want ot carry rescue coils long enough to reach the person in the hole) on the clothes, drop either the fleece shirt or the nano pullover. If you can't wear all the clothes at once, you brought too much. Bring the hardshells no matter the weather. If it turns or makes it own weather, the hard shells will save you. hands- just the liners and mitts. see above rule. just my opinion, but I would not bring a helmet for the emmons. maybe the DC. drop the ice screw and goggles. If you need goggles, you should be walking downhill. I would get the AL crampons instead. Not just for the hiking in but when it is on the feet too. Lifting the foot up every step is easier. Like having lighter boots vs heavy clunking plastics. have your self arrest and CR skills down solid. You may not have other folks around to help out if you get in trouble. The emmons has some traffic but nothing like the DC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADKMan Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) 2 person rope team with a 30 m rope can be really hard to do crevasse rescue. If you freind is going to cut up his 60m rope, have him cut it down to 50m or 45m. Any less and the spacing is too close between the two of you That was our thought as well. He was thinking of cutting the rope down to 40-45M just my opinion, but I would not bring a helmet for the emmons. maybe the DC. Never thought about that, is it typical not to use a helmet on the Emmons route? Edited March 23, 2012 by ADKMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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