Autoxfil Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 I sent this email to MEC a while ago and got no response. Has anyone noticed this before? Everyone raves about Evazote, but the numbers don't add up. I was thinking about getting one of your Evazote foam pads. However, looking at the specs, I'm confused. The 1cm Evazote pad is an R-value of 1.6, so warmth per thickness is R1.6/cm. But the other two thicnkesses, 0.5cm (R0.66)and 1.5cm R2.06), are both ~R1.35/cm. Is one of those in error? Looking further, I noticed that the Evazote pads are very heavy - 175g for the very thin Bivy pad. At 220g, the Blue foam pad offers an R value of 1.36: twice the warmth, and only 25% more weight. Two blue foam pads would get me an R-value of 2.72, at 2cm thickness, and only 440g. The Winter Evazote pad is over 2x the cost, 525g, and only R 2.06. So, what do the Evazote pads do? I always hear that it's some kind of great material, but they just appear to be heavy, cold, and expensive. They are somewhat warmer for a given thickness, but a cheap Ridgerest or self-inflating pad beats them handily there as well. Further investigation showed that Granite Gear sells Evazote pads with 1/2 the weight per thickness. Thier 150x50x0.95cm pad is only 156g, to your 1cm pad's 350g. This makes me wonder if your numbers are right, because while they don't offer R-value data, they claim that Evazote is 1/2 the density as your specs show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 I used ridge rest pads for years and prefer Evazote pads for a number of reasons: 1) My 72" Evazote pad weighs 10oz and is in my subjective opinion as warm as my Ridge Rest @ 19oz 2) Snow wipes off of Evazotte pads eaiser than Ridge Rests 3) Evazotte pads are very durable and can't be popped like Thermarests Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OlympicMtnBoy Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 You might try asking at one of the ultralight backpacking site, but I think Evazote just defines the type of foam, but that there are different grades (densities) that will have different r-values and may be available in different thicknesses. All grades may not be available in all thicknesses, and different companies sell slightly different varieties. http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=15694 The main thing for me in this type of bad is that it is pretty durable (especially compared to inflatable pads) and works great as a half pad strapped to my pack on climbs where it gets scraped over rocks and laid out on uneven rocky bivy sites with no ground cloth or anything. I have no idea what exact grade I use, the weight differences for my cut down torso sized pad are pretty minimal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Real hardman uses the yellow pad. http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&sqi=2&ved=0CBwQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fcascadeclimbers.com%2Fforum%2Fubbthreads.php%2Ftopics%2F445311%2F&rct=j&q=yellow%20hardman%20pad&ei=dOxmTcbPH4mqsAPLh9mmBA&usg=AFQjCNGM9kd64RB40-SnyfvOkVHgYvsysw&cad=rja Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layton Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 I think the science of determining R values for pocket change items is gonna be pretty loose. I also think that there are going to be diminishing returns the thicker you get...there is going to be a thinnest amount doing the most insulative work. Closed cell foam pads excel because you are taking advantage of the fact that you are using the minimum thickness for the most insulation. No one uses thick foam pads for alpine, everyone gets thin pads. Ridge rests and Z-rests are the best weight to warmth you're going to get, but they don't roll up as tight on the side of your pack as a thin-ass closed cell pad. Finally there are varying grades of quality...the blue ones (i believe) are the cheapest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crackers Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 ... I think Evazote just defines the type of foam, ... Ding ding ding! Folks, we've got a winner. EvaZote is brand of Zote foams referring to those zote foams with EVA. There are a lot of different options. Here at CiloGear, we use EV-50 and EV-30 Evazote in our shoulder straps and hipbelts in different thicknesses. They've got flame retardant ones, they've got anti-static, you name it they are all EvaZote... Without knowing the specific type and density you've got nothing. EvaZote has good insulative characteristics, but it is the ultimate affordable foam for compression set resistance. Hope it helps! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dberdinka Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 crackers... what kind of foam do you use in the back panels of your packs (the stiff stuff)? Better yet, do you know I can get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonG Posted May 17, 2011 Share Posted May 17, 2011 Oh man, this thread made my day. I had thought the hardman pads were out of production (not sure where I heard that rumor). Not so: http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442094583&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302701645 Cool, mine is looking pretty sorry with duct tape patches and all. And no, I am not hard. This is my knock around camp pad, so I don't have to worry about popping the thermarest . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crackers Posted May 18, 2011 Share Posted May 18, 2011 Better yet, do you know I can get it? Call us. How much do you want? 503.305.3858 ... from 9 to 5 Portland time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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