Dino Rossi

[ivan]

i would say, more accurately, that the majority of people who don't vote are lazy fucks.

is it that they're lazy or they're apathetic? they're not quite the same thing, are they? voting in washington is so fucking easy you have to take the definition to hair-brained heights to be so lazy as to not look for a stamp and motor-scooter to the mailbox.

 

i suppose the good thing about apathetic folks is, w/ the right machine, you can extract a lot of votes from that population.

 

 

[prole]

My observation is that progressive just don't like to do any real, effective work because its simply not sexy enough. Makes sense...they're not in it for the results...they're in it to feel good about themselves - and better than the rest of us. They need to be on the 'outside' to do that. They actually can't be successful...that would put them on the 'inside'.

 

Guess every society has to have its useless movements.

 

 

 

Well enjoy becoming another burnt-out husk of an Democrat activist who put their faith in a system that was rigged against them from the get-go. The good news is you've already found the martyr (yourself) and the scapegoat (your own people) for your suffering.

[tvashtarkatena]

Well, the Rfucks do practice racial vote suppression - they hate blacks and blacks hate 'em back - so the solution is to out vote 'em and negate the effect (while exposing and challenging their tactics in court, of course).

 

And the question is - What have the Dems done lately? A lot of hand wringing and not much else for minorities, women, gays, and the middle class. What is to be proud of lately?

 

Um...most 'progressive' bills have to have bipartisan sponsorship to have the best hope of passing.

 

We're fighting the last great discrimination battle in this country right now. WA just passed a domestic partnership law. CA's got a pot legalization initiative on the ballot that has a good chance of passing. WA will probably follow suit - putting a torpedo right into the magazine of the Drug War. Guantanamo is being closed (late, but its still happening), in contrast to 5 years ago.

 

All this, and you're asking 'what have you done for us lately?'

 

Get out of your straight, middle class white guy bubble and look around. There's a ton of good change happening...even if you're not aware of it.

 

Guess you'd have to be in the game to know.

 

 

[ivan]

 

Well enjoy becoming another burnt-out husk of an Democrat activist who put their faith in a system that was rigged against them from the get-go. The good news is you've already found the martyr (yourself) and the scapegoat (your own people) for your suffering.

dude, he's an irishman - he's doomed to be burnt-out anyhow!

[j_b]

With progressives, there's one excuse after the next about the failure of their own movement. Those Big, Bad Republicans and their vote suppression, etc.

 

The GOP prevented 70,000 primarily low income people from voting in Florida 2000 on the basis that their name was similar to that of convicted felons. It has been shown that ~40,000 of them weren't felons. Gore "lost" by less than a 1000 votes because GOP operatives rioted to prevent a recount.

 

And TVash blames Nader, and absolves the GOP goons. What a crock of shit.

Edited November 1, 2010 by j_b

[Jim]

Well, the Rfucks do practice racial vote suppression - they hate blacks and blacks hate 'em back - so the solution is to out vote 'em and negate the effect (while exposing and challenging their tactics in court, of course).

 

And the question is - What have the Dems done lately? A lot of hand wringing and not much else for minorities, women, gays, and the middle class. What is to be proud of lately?

 

Um...most 'progressive' bills have to have bipartisan sponsorship to have the best hope of passing.

 

We're fighting the last great discrimination battle in this country right now. WA just passed a domestic partnership law. CA's got a pot legalization initiative on the ballot that has a good chance of passing. WA will probably follow suit - putting a torpedo right into the magazine of the Drug War. Guantanamo is being closed (late, but its still happening), in contrast to 5 years ago.

 

All this, and you're asking 'what have you done for us lately?'

 

Get out of your straight, middle class white guy bubble and look around. There's a ton of good change happening...even if you're not aware of it.

 

Guess you'd have to be in the game to know.

 

Spare us the savior narrative again.

 

 

[tvashtarkatena]

My observation is that progressive just don't like to do any real, effective work because its simply not sexy enough. Makes sense...they're not in it for the results...they're in it to feel good about themselves - and better than the rest of us. They need to be on the 'outside' to do that. They actually can't be successful...that would put them on the 'inside'.

 

Guess every society has to have its useless movements.

 

 

 

Well enjoy becoming another burnt-out husk of an Democrat activist who put their faith in a system that was rigged against them from the get-go. The good news is you've already found the martyr (yourself) and the scapegoat (your own people) for your suffering.

 

Yes, I'm but a shell of a man, not a vibrant, virile seed of progressive change, patiently awaiting that golden moment when the perfect amount of rain and sun will transform you into that beautiful, showy flower the rest of us can only gush over.

[prole]

Get out of your straight, middle class white guy bubble and look around.

 

That's a laugh.

 

Gay Weed, the Final Battle for Civilization

 

Edited November 1, 2010 by prole

[j_b]

I'm not disagreeing with you. The state of politics sucks with little evidence of either party trying to tackle the hard issues. Ok, ok. We know the Republicans are worse but the Dems have just been enablers. Third party candidates have an uphill battle given all the structural barriers. And great - work to get in supposedly left of center democrats and what happens - not much in the past 20 years.

 

I know we don't disagree but I wanted to once again point out that TVash isn't touching how the Dems voting record in congress under Bush validated Nader's candidacy.

[tvashtarkatena]

Well, the Rfucks do practice racial vote suppression - they hate blacks and blacks hate 'em back - so the solution is to out vote 'em and negate the effect (while exposing and challenging their tactics in court, of course).

 

And the question is - What have the Dems done lately? A lot of hand wringing and not much else for minorities, women, gays, and the middle class. What is to be proud of lately?

 

Um...most 'progressive' bills have to have bipartisan sponsorship to have the best hope of passing.

 

We're fighting the last great discrimination battle in this country right now. WA just passed a domestic partnership law. CA's got a pot legalization initiative on the ballot that has a good chance of passing. WA will probably follow suit - putting a torpedo right into the magazine of the Drug War. Guantanamo is being closed (late, but its still happening), in contrast to 5 years ago.

 

All this, and you're asking 'what have you done for us lately?'

 

Get out of your straight, middle class white guy bubble and look around. There's a ton of good change happening...even if you're not aware of it.

 

Guess you'd have to be in the game to know.

 

Spare us the savior narrative again.

 

 

That's right Jim. Those organizations that actually accomplish something have a 'savior complex'. If a few useless-as-tits-on-a-bull progressives look at it that way with no small amount of envy, so be it. After all, irrelevant is irrelevant.

[ivan]

Spare us the savior narrative again.

 

honestly though, you are missing the point - if the economy was roaring along few would be harshing on the donkies right now - that's the one and only issue that's really pissing people off, and sadly its the kinda issue that really no party can solve w/ any speed or certainity - there ARE good things going on (if prop 19 passed i might even be persuaded to believe in dog again), they're just overshadowed and outshouted by the madmen of fox

[tvashtarkatena]

j-b could apparently stand to look up the words 'acknowledge' and 'absolve', assuming he's capable of that level of granularity. Given the repetition and dearth of variety in his posts, I would guess not.

[j_b]

Spare us the savior narrative again.

 

honestly though, you are missing the point - if the economy was roaring along few would be harshing on the donkies right now -

 

Democrats were told that the stimulus was too small especially considering that half of it were tax cuts that did little to create jobs. If Dems had been seen to go to bat for mainstreet instead of repeatedly caving in to the banksters (O's team right of Goldman Sachs, bailout without strings, no effective re-rgulation of wall street, etc..) many fewer would be harsh on Democrats.

[j_b]

j-b could apparently stand to look up the words 'acknowledge' and 'absolve', assuming he's capable of that level of granularity.

 

what didn't I understand in your statement that voter suppression by the GOP wasn't an issue?

 

Given the repetition and dearth of variety in his posts, I would guess not.

 

I'll repeat them as long as you keep dodging.

[prole]

Make no mistake, given Democrats and Republicans' current ideological framework, "getting the economy roaring again" means intensifying the assfucking that working people are already getting.

[ivan]

Democrats were told that the stimulus was too small especially considering that half of it were tax cuts that did little to create jobs. If Dems had been seen to go to bat for mainstreet instead of repeatedly caving in to the banksters (O's team right of Goldman Sachs, bailout without strings, no effective re-rgulation of wall street, etc..) many fewer would be harsh on Democrats.

i doubt it - the nature of any large public is that of a dumb beast - no speech or policy will mollify it - the dems coulda kicked the bankers square in the nuts repeatedly for the past 2 years, and if unemployment was still at 10%, it would only have been used by the opposition to justify their ouster

 

people need jobs - all the other shit is window-dressing to them, and understandbly so

[ivan]

Make no mistake, given Democrats and Republicans' current ideological framework, "getting the economy roaring again" means intensifying the assfucking that working people are already getting.

that's probably true, but then we are a people fond of s'n'm style sheenanigins

 

 

[prole]

people need jobs - all the other shit is window-dressing to them, and understandbly so

 

Where are they going to come from? Buying other countries' shit in exchange for our IOUs isn't happening anymore. Get it? IT'S DONE. What's next?

[j_b]

Democrats were told that the stimulus was too small especially considering that half of it were tax cuts that did little to create jobs. If Dems had been seen to go to bat for mainstreet instead of repeatedly caving in to the banksters (O's team right of Goldman Sachs, bailout without strings, no effective re-rgulation of wall street, etc..) many fewer would be harsh on Democrats.

i doubt it - the nature of any large public is that of a dumb beast - no speech or policy will mollify it - the dems coulda kicked the bankers square in the nuts repeatedly for the past 2 years, and if unemployment was still at 10%, it would only have been used by the opposition to justify their ouster

 

people need jobs - all the other shit is window-dressing to them, and understandbly so

 

I believe that creating more jobs would have helped, which is the reason I pointed out that a bigger more relevant stimulus was needed. Yet, I don't believe that people are voting for the GOP as much as people aren't turning out because they don't believe their vote matters. They voted for change and nothing happened, there is no more important lesson from the past 2 years.

[kevbone]

What's next?

 

 

Take your pick.....

 

 

 

 

 

[Peter_Puget]

linky

 

The whining utopian left J_B has a very full schedule of despising Republicans and the idiots and scoundrels (a little over half the country) who keep voting for them. Yet it he can always find time to attack its his own team, cry and complain, and demand to be patted on the head. The left’sJ_B's role in Tuesday’s elections should not go unacknowledged.

 

 

Edited November 1, 2010 by Peter_Puget

[kevbone]

They voted for change and nothing happened, there is no more important lesson from the past 2 years.

 

Quote of the day!

[j_b]

Republicans and the idiots and scoundrels (a little over half the country) who keep voting for them.

 

~25% of the voting age population is "over half the country"?

 

your arithmetic aint 2 gud.

[tvashtarkatena]

j-b could apparently stand to look up the words 'acknowledge' and 'absolve', assuming he's capable of that level of granularity.

 

what didn't I understand in your statement that voter suppression by the GOP wasn't an issue?

 

Given the repetition and dearth of variety in his posts, I would guess not.

 

 

 

I'll repeat them as long as you keep dodging.

 

You, like FW, are pretty good at quoting. Try quoting what I actually posted, tack your statement to it, and see if it makes sense...to anyone.

 

Of course, you're not stranger to that outcome, either.

[tvashtarkatena]

They voted for change and nothing happened, there is no more important lesson from the past 2 years.

 

Quote of the day!

 

That half any voting population are morons is pretty much a statistical necessity, no?