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telemarker

Building rack

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Okay, if you had Camalots numbers .75 thru 3.5, and had the opportunity to double up on a couple cams, which would you choose? We're talking about gear climbs mostly in the Icicle.

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Thanks for the info. Of course, they're heavy so doubling up on them may not be the best option? Or does their range make up for all the xtra friends you'd carry? Matter of style, I guess. I've climbed with a guy whose rack consisted of 17 cams, all mismatched because 16 of them were what he's found over the years. Come to think of it, paying retail sucks shit.

John

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Your question was not clear then. What do you have? Get some yellow and blue TCus if you dont. Then get some stoppers. Cheap. Yellow Tcu covers good range and is valuable as well as blue and gray.. Get some hexes. They seem archaic but I like them a lot and see them more useful on some kinds of rock... Especially granite.

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Ray's right, get the yellow and blue TCU and the orange one too. But it won't be doubling up though because all those will be smaller than what you got. If you wanna double up get the yellow TCU and a yellow Alien.

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quote:

Originally posted by telemarker:
I've climbed with a guy whose rack consisted of 17 cams, all mismatched because 16 of them were what he's found over the years.

Hey,I know that bonehead.

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Yeah, that bonehead is nuts, eh? Oh, and the other piece of gear on his rack I forgot to mention was the crescent wrench!

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i have all my cams doubled and find that with that i tend to want to bring more and what not....big mistake (i think) i have started to only operate with a set blue tcu through #4 camalot......and i guess i bring stoppers too(anyone now how to use those things?)

but for doubling up i would say get sizes that you find hard to climb...for me it would be the .5-.75 range those tights hands get me every time.....and maybe the orange tcu(imo is a great piece) the yellow tcu/alien is a great finger size.....so maybe pick up another blue tcu(tight fingers)....

i think purple and grey tcus have really limited applications and i even sometimes dont even bring them, work da stopper.......but i am weak too and love to just push a cam in......

after that even though a 2" hand crack is bomber maybe get a double of that as it kinda spans the 1" - 3" range kinda.......

but always remember when in doubt run it out!!!! wasting too much energy trying to fiddle the gear in is what causes the fatty whippers.......

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I take the 4 largest hexes instead of double cams on many routes. It saves weight and expense, especially if you have to leave a piece.

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As several have said above, the blue, yellow, orange, and red tcu are great in both application and operation. I'm not sure how small a .75 camalot is, but I know it's not as small as a yellow tcu.

As far as doubling: in my expereince, the number of climbs out there that REQUIRE doubling on certain sizes isn't that great. Yeha, they're out there, but especially in the PNW it seems a well distributed rack does fine. But, I have doubles of the .5" to 1.5" and carry them along in my pack. If I get excited (to do a climb!) and need them, I can pull them out. Otherwise, they take a nap in the bottom of the sack. Sorta' like the #4 camalot.

PS: I can't wait for spring!

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quote:

Originally posted by max:
I'm not sure how small a .75 camalot is, but I know it's not as small as a yellow tcu.

same size as a black metolius fcu....red tcu is a .5

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I place my .5 Camalot on almost every pitch I climb so if you don't have one I suggest you take a look. The most recent additions to my rack are the .3 and .4 Micro-Camalots (BD) and they are very nice. I think they are nicer than the corresponding Metolius TCU sizes.

Black Diamond Camalots are the nicest cams out there, but they are very heavy. If you want doubles of certain sizes get something other than BD. I have doubles of .5-2: one set of BD Camalots and one set of Kong cams (so old that I wish I could replace them, but there are other things higher one my wish list).

Hexes are very nice. Bomber in the right rock and always useful. Don't get the new wired Hexes. I don't know why BD switched to wires, this is a stupid set up and my guess is they will switch back in a few years.

Just another reason why trad climbing is better than sport climbing . . . [big Drink]

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quote:

Originally posted by danielpatricksmith:
I take the 4 largest hexes instead of double cams on many routes. It saves weight and expense, especially if you have to leave a piece.

Check the weight specs from the manufacturers. The #11 hex is 10 grams lighter than the #4 forged Friend. The #10 hex is only 4 grams lighter than a #3.5 friend. So you may save some weight on those but not very much. You start saving more weight on the smaller sizes (24 grams, almost an oz) on the #8 Hex versus 2.5 Friend.

Hexes definitely ARE cheaper though. But the fiddle factor is sooo much worse with Hexes than Friends.

I think if you wanna double up on the big cams I say get yourself a #4 Camalot (they are so nice when weight isn't an issue) and get the #4 Friend for when weight is an issue. The #8 hex seems worthwhile because it actually saves a reasonable amount of weight AND you don't have to worry as much about the fiddle factor because when you're placing this one you'll be in a bomber handcrack.

see size by weight pro charts for more comparisons.

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I agree with those saying buy some TCUs. One thing to remember about all the talk concerning wieght is that for most Icicle climbs, in fact most climbs in general, it is really not going to be a big factor.

PP

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Hello,Gray and Purple TCUs are good because I use them a lot when I climb in Vantage. On the shitty rock good pro means a lot...

Some day I would expect homey to graduate. My main advice DONT BUY CAMALOTS TOO HEAVY. Green Metolius is like Camalot#1 Bably Blue is like the #2 and so forth...

Also a heavy rack may not mean a lot but like I said if homey gets bored then in the long run future I personally believe agains buying heavy stuff. Hexes are good and so are offset HB stoppers.

Last sunday I climbed a crack with all cams. Most of the pro sucked because the cams walked around. Large hexes would have protected it better..

At any rate I used to think like some people above but I guess everyone develops their own styles wink.gif" border="0[chubit]

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ray, i found that if i fit the cam a littel tighter they tend walk less..... and bd cams since their range is better tend to fit cracks better.....the lack of range on most cams dont allow you to fit them tighter..........cuz their effective ranbge is quite reduced and there fore a tigher fit means a fixed fit.....i would say in my experience that i see less bd cams fixed then most other brands with wc being the biggest offenders......

partially i think also is stem length....bd cams seem to have the longest stems....therefore moaking it easier to clean.....

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E Dog I dont think I need a lesson in cam placement but I understand where you come from...

I think this crack would not have taken the BD cams well either. Trust me I am a gumby but I know how to use my gear.

Yor Funny! grin.gif" border="0

Also I dont recommend starting a beginner rack with Gray and Purple Nurple TCUs just dont downplay then on thin face climbing..

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Ditto what Puget said. In my opinion, weight is over-emphasized as a selection criteria. Personally, I like the Aliens in the smaller sizes (they are light, very flexible and they place in a greater variety of placements than most, but they get sticky faster and you can't shove them in beyond your reach as easily as with a TCU) and in the larger sizes, I like Camelots (on the heavy side, but I just like the way they feel). And I agree with Ray -- I like the tiny ones.

Ray - you complained of wobbly cams where hexes would have been more secure. Were you climbing at Tieton, perhaps? That is an unusual affliction but I have seen it over there at Tieton quite a bit.

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Hello Matt no I was climbing Vantage Choss. At least most of it is Choss grin.gif" border="0

Yes the Yellow and red aliens rock. The BD Camalots in that range really suck. I dont like anything smaller than #1.

The only camalot I now own is a #3. I replaced all of them..

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I'm color blind but no matter what color sling is on it, chuck that hex as far away as possible. I used them when they were the only "camming" device available and they even work. But if I have a camalot and a hex and I'm hangin by my wimpy arms, I'm reaching for the camalot.

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Reading over everyone's replies here it sounds like folks favor TCUs over aliens. True? If so, why? I have a bunch of aliens and love 'em, partly because they are narrower and so can fit in smaller latteral pockets. (I think they are as narrow or more so than the equivalent TCU even though they have 4 cams...) Wondering if I'm missing something...

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i like both equally as well, they both serve the same purpose but like you said, they each do it slightly differently and having as many options as possible makes things easier......

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