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SplashClimber

Cordalette - shorten up tie-in point off boulder

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So what would be the best (fast but safe) way to shorten up the master tie-in point on a cordalette already slung around a boulder/tree etc? (Some givens, want to deal with fact that boulder is already slung, and you need to be much closer into the tie-in because you are on a small ledge for instance, or do not want to be pulled very far). So I just want to specifically know how to shorten up the tie-in point distance.

 

(Below) Here is the before picture, and some suggested after pictures follow. Note - the couch is a boulder :). So I want to shorten up the tie-in point.

cord1.JPG

(Below) Is this a good way... tie a fig-8 on a bite, and then really should tie-back up where the arrow is pointing.

cord2.JPG

 

(Below) Another way that seems to be fast (hard to tell from picture but take the bite of rope and wrap lots of times around the standing rope, then loop it back through ( sort of like a klemheist)

cord3.JPG

 

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Neither of those looks all that stable. I would recommend:

 

1. Reslinging the "boulder", doubled up

2. Undoing the master point and tying it closer to the clipping point

3. Tie a few overhand knots along the master point

4. Or just use 2 pieces of double-length webbing instead, if possible

 

The first one would work if you used a normal figure 8 as opposed to a figure 8 on a bight.

 

-Mark

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Thank-you for your response...

 

I suppose I should have mentioned that when you double up the cordalette around the boulder/couch it ends up being way too short to enable putting in a fig-8 or an overhand.

 

I also want the master point to be closer to the couch, not way out as shown in the first diagram. (scnerio setup --- want masterpoint closer to couch because I do not want to be close to a ledge).

 

Great idea about tying a few overhand knots along the master point.

 

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Couldn't you just clove hitch in closer to the master point also clipping the resultant loop of extra cordage below your clove hitch as a back up?

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One way would be to tie an Alpine Butterfly with both strands of cord wherever you want the master point to be, than clip the loops of the butterfly and the resultant loop "tail" of the butterfly with at least one 'biner. I think I've actually done that a couple of times.

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You could just clip the main loop going around the couch. Is that close enough

Close enough, but don't you really want something that is a bit more fixed/un-movable? If you have the biner on a fig-8 then the biner will not be sliding all over the place thus, changing the location of your master point? So maybe fig-8 is "better", and just clipping into main loop around the couch is "acceptable"?

Edited by SplashClimber

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NoahT has the quickest solution. The only problem I see is that you are then loading the F8 knot in expansion which isn't ideal. I wouldn't worry about the sliding around - it's going to allow the load to settle in and equalize properly. Just make sure the angle is not too great where the biner is clipped in.

 

The 1st (doubled F8B) of your ideas looks fine.

 

You could rethread the bight (not bite) that you have clipped in the 1st pic back through the original F8 and you would have a nice shortened up MAP (master attachment point). Or just grab the whole lot originally and tie it that way...

 

P1013439.JPG

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You that idea looks fine with the fig 8 on a bight, hell look at long's anchor book, how he shortens the equallette and uses 3 pieces to equalize instead of 4. Anywho, also with that extra little nub that's causing everybody grief, why don't you just make a triple fig 8 out of it, and the problem is rectified.

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You could rethread the bight (not bite) that you have clipped in the 1st pic back through the original F8 and you would have a nice shortened up MAP (master attachment point). Or just grab the whole lot originally and tie it that way...

P1013439.JPG

 

Ah, that seems like the easiest, and thank-you so much for the picture too, it really helped clarify the solution.

 

It is a bit much for me to chew/bite though :chebit:... Ha (re: bight vs bite. :grin: Just an homophone oversight on my part.)

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RE....

You that idea looks fine with the fig 8 on a bight, hell look at long's anchor book, how he shortens the equallette and uses 3 pieces to equalize instead of 4.
Thank-you for the Long reference (2nd edition pg 167 - left biner) --- really sheds more light on the "tail" issue (non-issue?!)

 

RE...

why don't you just make a triple fig 8 out of it, and the problem is rectified.
What do you mean by a triple fig 8 (joke?, joking about putting in in 3 separate fig-8's?)

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That is not a Figure9, which is a totally different knot. It is a Double F8 or "Bunny Ears."

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I know it as a double-bight figure eight. Sounds like there's not a lot of consensus on this one. Wonder what AMGA calls it?

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In response to original question:

 

Your second photo (with the red arrow pointing to the tail loop) would be fine with me if you just clip the tail into the same carabiner as the Master Point. It's redundant, strong, clean, and simple.

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