billcoe Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 This rhetoric and over the shoulder two step aids the enemy more than it aids your own troops trying to do their job. Then once we incarcerate someone openly conducting warfare, we have to justify to someone, like you, despite every common sense indicator justifying use of force the guy on the ground utilized to capture PUC. So when did non citizens start receiving due process under US law, with an almost ferocious backing by liberals bent on establishing new world order. One people, one government? Thank God for civilian oversight, it's been there since the very start of the country btw, and is still there despite congress sleeping on this one. We can probably stop discussing all the minutia and side issues as JH just totally nailed it right on the money with this post. The manipulation, lies and deciept from all quarters of the Bush administration that resulted in us attacking Iraq was outrageous. That they have put folks like you into harms way based on lies hurts even deeper. Many still hope that like Roosevelt's secret and illegal assistance to Britan WW2, that there MUST have been something behind the magic curtain to somehow have justified this.......(still waiting but not holding my breath for that BTW) Here's the best post to come around in a long time. Translation and summation of previous nine posts: Reasonable people wail at the corruption of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights of the United States of America, and of the treasonous and inept prosecution of unnecessary preemptive war. We wail at the shame of the establishment and employment of the exact camps and methods that we as a nation have prosecuted others as war criminals and for crimes against humanity. Not much to add to that work of art there. Of course, although it really doesn't mention Gitmo and the prisoners there, you can certainly get there and a bunch of other places fast enough if you just consider it for a moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 (edited) I've got a direct, inside line to what goes on there, both from the legal and treatment of prisoners standpoint. Let's just call it my little secret. you are a fucking liar. you say this kinda crap all the time. I am still waiting for the pictures of your hand blown glass table you made; or is your camera still broken? Oh and you still haven't told us what part of the military you were in. You are so full of shit your eyes smell. I know some other people think you are full of it too. You pretentious fuck. Why don't you peddle your lies to 8 year olds who don't have the capacity to debunk them? I would think 'smarmy' would be more apropos in my case. Somebody's button got pressed. I've heard boning up on the Army Field Manual is a good way to regain your sense of inner peace. BTW, I did not have sex on that non-existent hand blown glass table. I swear on the Bible that it exists, though. Honest. Edited March 12, 2009 by tvashtarkatena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 (edited) This rhetoric and over the shoulder two step aids the enemy more than it aids your own troops trying to do their job. This 'put up and shut up' argument is probably the oldest bullshit propaganda ploy in history. 'Support our stupid fucking war, because if you don't, you're aiding those fucking Ughurs who are hate our freedom'. Um...no. We're Americans. We don't 'put up and shut up'. Democracy: We run the joint, remember? 'The troops' are Americans, too. Well, most of them, anyway. In any case, they also have a right to know that most of us back home don't support them being there, nor do we buy the whole 'war on terror' line. They can make a more informed decision about their future that way. Edited March 12, 2009 by tvashtarkatena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenity Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 I think it's pretty funny reading what you troop of blowhards have to offer up here. You guys are so far out there, you don't even know how close to the edge of the ice flow you've gotten. http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/01/17/politics/politicalhotsheet/entry4730094.shtml http://www.thehotjoints.com/2008/11/25/rasmussen-poll-49-want-to-keep-gitmo-open/ Looks like more people actually support keeping the site open for it's intended use, and that was the detention and debrief of combatants who do not fall easily into a geneva conventions category. You guys seem to want to play by the rules for a game that has changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenity Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 Furthermore, since your so gung-ho to get these guys out of Gitmo, how about you personally house one of them in your spare room, feed them, clothe them, make sure they get to their court appearances, pay their attorney fees, wipe their ass, give them psychological counseling to deter their hatred and anger towards the US, etc. Oh, and don't call me or 'my kind' to come help you when you're getting choked the fuck out by that same person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I think it's pretty funny reading what you troop of blowhards have to offer up here. You guys are so far out there, you don't even know how close to the edge of the ice flow you've gotten. http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/01/17/politics/politicalhotsheet/entry4730094.shtml http://www.thehotjoints.com/2008/11/25/rasmussen-poll-49-want-to-keep-gitmo-open/ Looks like more people actually support keeping the site open for it's intended use, and that was the detention and debrief of combatants who do not fall easily into a geneva conventions category. You guys seem to want to play by the rules for a game that has changed. Well, it's true we may be cluelessly living on the edge of an icefield, but this ice flow sure seems pretty crowded as it drifts out to sea. Maybe because its the Pacific NW, home of the Other White Meat? Those solid, salt of the earth folks in the plains states will start crowding in later like they always do as more time goes on and they think it over. Locking innocent people up for life imprisonment with no trial or hope of release until some faceless and nameless authority figure decides to let you go isn't in the American Makeup. Sure, we all know that there's more guilty than not in there, but it doesn't change the fact. In my mind, it's better to dismantle this symbol of abuse sooner, so that the real shitbags in there can get dealt with before emotions deal a different hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephH Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 No, it was 'opened' as an extrordinary rendition endpoint where torture could be used and it was specifically chosen for its supposed extra-Constitutional status (which even a heavily conservative SCOTUS made very clear it wasn't). Thank god our founding fathers weren't as wishy-washy as today's conservatives when it came to holding their values and understanding what's important in the face of changing rules and games - they didn't call it a 'constitution' for nothing. The saddest part of all was the neocons corrupted America's values and Constitution in a perverse quest for 'restoring dominance' for a "New American Century" and not out the slightest interest in a war on terror, which was always just an anthem. Again, I'd be shocked if even 25 of the 500 were detainees of sufficient value to even merit the effort, expense, and damage to our standing in the world. This whole rendition slice of the neocon's preemptive war strategy was high treason in and of itself as was the torturous legal letters issued from the OLC to support it. From pretty much any perspective, but especially from increasing U.S. security and influence, everything about both wars and the 'war on terror' have been an abject political, diplomatic, and military failure. It's not your fault, you guys currently in the military do what you do to the best of your ability and do it well; unfortunately, the clowns wielding U.S. military might for the past eight years were completely incompetent to do so. I and any number of guys I know could have done infinitely better with the same resources; in fact, I have no doubt you also could have done better and would have done things quite differently yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Oh, and don't call me or 'my kind' to come help you when you're getting choked the fuck out by that same person. Look, fellas, we got freakin Captain America ovah heuh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 I'd be shocked if even 25 of the 500 were detainees of sufficient value to even merit the effort, expense, and damage to our standing in the world. This whole rendition slice of the neocon's preemptive war strategy was high treason in and of itself as was the torturous legal letters issued from the OLC to support it. From pretty much any perspective, but especially from increasing U.S. security and influence, everything about both wars and the 'war on terror' have been an abject political, diplomatic, and military failure. That's the real point here. Nobody, and in this case I include Serenity and Alkateke, have even tried to tell us how and why Gitmo has helped make America more secure. Instead they warn of the "Bogeyman" and say "you liberals don't understand what is at stake." I think we do. Terrorism is no joke, but our recent activities have only fed the beast and last I heard all rational analysis says we are in fact little or no better protected against terrorist attack now than we were eight years ago but, at the same time, we've lowered our standing and damaged our reputation around the world. I'm not referring to GWB specifically but to the fact that after 911 we had an opportunity to show leadership and resolve and, yes, power. We showed the opposite and the "we're fighting the terrorists and you guys who don't support that want America to fail" constituency can only urge us to continue to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenity Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 Oh, and don't call me or 'my kind' to come help you when you're getting choked the fuck out by that same person. Look, fellas, we got freakin Captain America ovah heuh! Lookie fellas we got a freaking Richard Simmons type ovah heuh! [img:center]http://paxarcana.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/richard_simmons.jpg[/img] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pink Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 blah, blah, blah...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Nevuh heoid 'v 'im ovah heuh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Yo! I'm ovah heuh, ovah heuh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Freakin' great. Now I can't fuck'n stop tooikin' like dis, ovah heuh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 so tvash, you're willing to admit you and serenity are both queer as $3 bills then? reading your dialect reminds me why mark twain books sometimes made me want to flush my brain down the tiolet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 I'll fuck anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Do everyone a favor by continuing to fuck yourself, only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 tvash as mcmurphy: "the next girl i get into is gonna light up like a slot machine and pay off in silver dollars!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 I'll fuck anything. Anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 ANYTHING! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 That'd be a small price to pay for being able to sport a male rhino's member. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Ovah heuh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenity Posted March 15, 2009 Author Share Posted March 15, 2009 [video:youtube]QJygJQNQHkw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 (edited) Watching, absorbing, spreading, and celebrating human suffering is clearly your thing. Like any bully, you're weak. Edited March 15, 2009 by tvashtarkatena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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