G-spotter Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Maybe you can get one made out of tinfoil. Then you'll be able to take off your foil hat inside it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotly Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 "it was a full 10 inches shorter than advertised when erect." Â Maybe it was cold out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndavidjr Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 And on your very next winter climb of Rainier, hopefully not with a $400 "Tarptent," y'all can say how wrong I was, while having a long discussion about whether magical wool underwear is really worth a week's wages. Â Next August, I'll be sleeping soundly somewhere in the Olympics in delightful weather and a spacious, $19 one-person tent that weighs almost nothing. Â I can't remember precise quote of a prominent NW climber in the volume in "Cascade Voices" (1998) wherein he distained clients that used Goretex in lieu of crappy coated nylon parkas, which at the time, he found entirely adequate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dannible Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Â Next August, I'll be sleeping soundly somewhere in the Olympics in delightful weather and a spacious, $19 one-person tent that weighs almost nothing. Â If indeed the weather is delightful I'll be sleeping soundly under the stars, which are free for all of us to enjoy, and weigh less than a one person tent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndavidjr Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 Bug netting (finest quality for extreme sleeping). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Thanks, JohnDavidJr. Maybe the cc.com equipment police aren't ready for your ideas but I hope others who are not quite so into gear for gear's sake will find your post informative. I don't disagree with the idea that good quality gear is often worth the money but, as you note, lots of cheapo gear works just fine. Â (Disclaimer: I am one who thinks a cheapo windbreaker and raincoat combination is at least if not more effective than goretex, and who uses a plain tarp for winter camping in the Cascades and Coast Range.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wastral Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 As one who never even bothered to take a tarp or a tent into the cascades for the first 10 years of backpacking/mountaineering, I find this discussion hilarious.  I never had the $$ for a tent. Took flannel $20 sleeping bags tied to the bottom of a kids backpack in a black plastic bag. If it rained, it was simply time to walk out.  Why are most of you guys so billigerent to calmly posted opinions?  Yea, I agree I wouldn't waste $20 on this tarp thing either. A blue tarp costs less! Or go to Pacific Fabrics and buy some lightweight sil-nylon that weighs less. I have only had mosquito problems at 1 lake in my entire backpacking life.  ON A DIFFERENT NOTE: MY QUICK REVIEW OF A TARPTENT IN EXTREME CONDITIONS!  I took a Tarptent Cloudburst 2 and added a middle pole. Now I don't get wet and its good for winter camping. Took this tent to Waddington Area for 3 weeks. 2 of those weeks were torential rain/wind/sleet/snow/wind, fun times... the 101th game of Go-Fish goes to.... WOO HOO I GOT THE JOKERS>>> HAHA eat it buddy!  Never got wet. When we did get condensation, it rolled down the inside of the cloth, and out through the mosquito netting on the bottom last 10 inches. Plenty of room for 2 with 0 degree sleeping bags and all our gear inside stayed dry as well.  The pack frames we left outside with black plastic bags over them when down lower. When on snow, you just dig a snow hole in front and everything stays dry.  Brian  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wastral Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I should have also said that we changed the front pole out, for a 5/8" self made pole instead of the standard 5/16" poles that commonly come in tents. Added Velcro tabs to keep the poles taunt for windy conditions. Â You ask, "Why we did this?" Because I really really like the layout of the cloudburst 2 for room/ventilation. Not to mention it cost us $200 while a true 4 season tent would cost $400 or more. No, I would not take this to Denali. Although with more testing I might. Â As J.... whatever his nic is, said, Fabric is fabric. It has to pass tests to be classified in its category, so it doesn't matter who makes it or where. The stitching is a different story of course! Â Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomtom Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 And on your very next winter climb of Rainier, hopefully not with a $400 "Tarptent," y'all can say how wrong I was, while having a long discussion about whether magical wool underwear is really worth a week's wages. Â Some things *are* worth it. Â Mmmm... Wool... Â baa baa baa baa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I have a Tarptent Cloudburst and it is pretty good in the rain. Didn't do so well in a blowing spindrift storm, though, but hey, that was stretching its design limit a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wastral Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 Yes, we had the same problem with the Cloudburst 2 and the Squal 2 which we took to the pickets for a week +++ trip. I love the layout and ease of setup. 2 minutes flat, no joking. Faster if you really want faster. Â It was for the reason of the wind that we added the center hoop/pole. The center hoop/pole is actually on the inside of the tent with the pole legs through gromets sown into the bottom of the tent. We also added the ability of tieing tension strands from the opposite side to the tent "feet" for super high wind conditions. Up near Waddington we never had to do this, it was either constant torrential rain or dead calm and a billion degrees out turning all the fresh snow into a pile of slop that kept sliding on us, fun times. Â Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndavidjr Posted January 10, 2009 Author Share Posted January 10, 2009 (edited) For same price or sometimes much less, the Golite, MSR, BD and OR shelters all look better than Cloudburst or Squall for iffy weather. I like my Hex for four seasons. Â My $20 K-Mart coated pup-tent worked great for a two-month bicycle trip, and at least as many other nights, frequently on beaches amid biting sand fleas, where floor and netting was very welcome and grit eventually ground the floor into mesh. Â Spent only one night in moderately severe weather using K-Mart tent. Floor did me in. Condensation and melting snow had no place to go... except into my sleeping bag. Not a ski-tent. Very unpleasant. Would expect similar issue with any coated canopy attached to coated floor, i.e. Cloudburst etc. Â I had a Mt. Hardwear "Batwing" for a while, which was possibly very similar to earlier "Tarptent/Squall designs. No floor, open in front with netting "door." Heavy rain would spray through netting. Edited January 11, 2009 by johndavidjr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 The advantage of a Tarptent is its weight. Does any other company produce a full sized, two man tent with floor and bug netting that weighs 2 lbs or under? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denalidave Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 The advantage of a Tarptent is its weight. Does any other company produce a full sized, two man tent with floor and bug netting that weighs 2 lbs or under? Personally, I'd much rather pack an extra 16 ounces (or so) and have a bomber shelter that is free standing and plenty roomy for one, tight but workable for two. I have an old Sierra Designs (Sphynx I think) that weighs just over 3lbs and although it is a "3 season" tent, I have used it on plenty of winter trips and it did well, although a bit cool due to the extra venting it has. It sets up in a minute or two and is very bomber in the wind. To bad they don't make that model anymore. I lived in it for 3 months my first summer in Alaska and it rained most of the summer that year. I suppose the tarp tent has it's place but not for me. If I really want to save weight, I'll just use a bivy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 For winter camping at or below timberline, the advantage of a tarp is not only weight. It offers much more comfort as well. All those who worried about my tarp protecting them ended up hanging out in my snow hole on nearly every ski-camping trip I've taken. A tarp is better for this purpose than a tarp tent, but neither is very good for camping in the alpine zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndavidjr Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 I had a winterized version of NF "Frog" style tent. Somewhat cramped and heavy. Due to fly and stormflaps, the thing was much warmer than Hex or Twin Peaks, which I've used fair bit in winter & summer. Â Used a Sierra Designs Half-Moon (?) 3-season lots in winter. Not as warm. Stolen at Stuart N.Side trailhead 1 day prior to big fire in August 94, I think. Â In severe bug-threat might go with Wal-Mart. Junking the fiberglass poles would bring it to negligible weight. If it in fact has storm flaps like my old K-Mart job, is more weather-proof than current "Tarptent" and is generally comparable summer shelter, though obviously smaller and vastly cheaper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairweather Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I regularly use a BD Betalight and have the "Betabug" insert for bug season. The floor of the bug is tough and the fact that your ski poles are also your tent poles cuts the weight down even more. The Betalight only portion is around 1 1/2 lbs and the bug, I think, is just over 2 lbs. Plenty of room for two people plus gear. I've even used it on Rainier in the summer. Also, sleeping with two ski poles between you and your partner prevents unwanted spooning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndavidjr Posted January 13, 2009 Author Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) My only experience camping on Olympic Penninsula in winter was at low elevations in various locations. I used an REI rectangular tarp in all instances, which are now purely historical. These things BTW, can be configured as enclosed pyramids, effective in snow, though it requires slight ingenuity.  My original point was that the $260 Tarptent probably performs similarly to a $19 Wal-Mart puptent. This is what the "backpackers" were so upset about. This crowd seems unduly interested in what brand of Band-Aides® one uses.... and various weird and pointless stuff like that.  Both the Wal-Mart puptent and "Tarptent" are practically not useable in winter. Unlike many tarp shelters... of which the BD Beta/Mega are probably the best known. Edited January 13, 2009 by johndavidjr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genepires Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 maybe you were banned because you go on and on about this. You made your point. Now let it just be, please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letsroll Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 that was my point on the first page, then it made it a second page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climbsonrocks Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 My original point was that the $260 Tarptent probably performs similarly to a $19 Wal-Mart puptent. This is what the "backpackers" were so upset about. This crowd seems unduly interested in what brand of Band-Aides® one uses.... and various weird and pointless stuff like that. Both the Wal-Mart puptent and "Tarptent" are practically not useable in winter. Unlike many tarp shelters... of which the BD Beta/Mega are probably the best known.  OK we disregard all the particular brands you pointed out in the first post (as it would, by your standards, be weird and pointless to regard what you point out there, by your own standards, so weird and pointlessly) and look at the practicality of the one-man, no-fly, cheepy, nylon tent and the practicality of the fly, more expensive, ultra-light, 2-3 man nylon tent.  My conclusion: If I am going to pack a tent I prefer to get one that is worth packing and not a cheepy, one-man, no-fly tent that might be better if I cut it down the middle and used it for a tarp tent that has some bug netting attached to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denalidave Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I can wear a garbage bag liner in the rain and not have to spend $400-$600 on a fancy schmancy gortex coat. I just bring a cheap roll of duct tape to repair it when it gets torn. Then, I sleep in it so I don't have to spend $20 on a tent at WalMart, or carry all that extra weight either. Best of all, I can usually get free garbage liners at any gas station or deli. I just dump the contents of the bag right into the dumpster and, viola, I'm all set for my next outdoor adventure. I like to get a couple extra, just in case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I never get a haircut or shave and weave the whole mess into a body suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 ...and in warmer temps, it is always accompanied by at least one fly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denalidave Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I never get a haircut or shave and weave the whole mess into a body suit. But does it have a rain fly? Or a pee fly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.