111 Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 wicked hard is it a boulder problem or a FA solo 6" off the ground, you decide! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crmlla2007 Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 That Pic w/drill is just begging for a comic text-balloon: "Pull my sleeve up so they can see my muscular and attractive arms. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 How tall is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tradclimbguy Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Sometimes it helps if you just read the article in the first place. "The new climb adds a sit start to the Alí Hulk Extension, creating the longest link-up in the low-ceilinged cave, where lines often are climbed without a rope but are given a route rating because of their length." Simply put it's a boulder problem better described with a sport rating due to the length of the climb. I don't think there is anything devious behind the sport rating... Heck, they describe it as a V14 + a 5.15a which is actually a combination of two lines already. The bigger question is why did they bolt it if it's only 6ft off the ground? My guess is just so they "mark" their spot to show they did it first and got the FA. Edit: Oh, and when did adding a sit start to a route change it's grade... Just another oddity to point out that it's obviously not the "norm" and is just a boulder problem. Sit start... hahaha Edited November 13, 2007 by tradclimbguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 They bolted it so they could work the moves, silly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tradclimbguy Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Ahhh. Now I would have just brought a step ladder and a crash pad with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Sometimes it helps if you just read the article in the first place. If you are referring to me….I did read it…..the entire article…. and I did not see in there if it gave a height. If so….my bad….if not…..HOW TALL IS THE CLIMB? Anyone? Because if the climb in question is the guy in the picture…..that is no boulder problem….that is route that would require a rope or you would be soloing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dt_3pin Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I'm pretty sure neither of the pictures accompanying the article have anything to do with the route/boulder problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 if you solo a sport route, can you call it trad, because you didn't clip any bolts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crmlla2007 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Highball boulder problems go to 30' or so. There are already V15 linkups that go on seemingly forever in caves (can't remember the name offhand - Japanese guy did it?). Thought the Class 5 rating meant "rope up or you might die" and in all honesty, while you could fall off your kitchen table and die, if it never goes over 10' or so it can't really be Class 5, can it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrogdortheBurninator Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 there is a long standing tradition of rating boulder problems, particularly crack problems, with yds grades in some parts of the US (montana, wyoming, etc). If local ethics in rodellar support a similar approach, why not just accept it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
111 Posted November 14, 2007 Author Share Posted November 14, 2007 There are already V15 linkups that go on seemingly forever in caves (can't remember the name offhand - Japanese guy did it?). Wheel of Life or something. Dai Koyomada (sp?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 V16 they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crmlla2007 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Found it V16 = linked V15's - links on right to Koyamada bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hafilax Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 [rant] I'm getting pretty tired of all the spray around the top grade. It's seems to me like they're really splitting hairs. The lower grades span quite a range of difficulty but all of the reasoning around the top grade sounds like 'Well I found it harder than that climb so it must deserve a higher grade.' Then someone repeats it in less time and downgrades it or doesn't say anything so that it looks like they're really that good. Grading for endurance has a double standard too. A 5.10a where each move is 5.10a is 'sustained' whereas linking a 5.14b into a 5.14c is '5.14d'? The system is broken and the magazines insist on perpetuating it. What ever happened to discussing the aesthetic of the line? I always thought it was cool that a route could have a move named after it because it was unique on the first ascent like Le Rose et le Vampire or Sharma talking about choosing to work a route because of some unique move or challenge. I watched the video of some super hard bouldering route in RMNP which was basically 2 moves. There's some super hard sport route in Rumney where the first 2 bolts were stick clipped and there was one more bolt to clip before the anchor which seemed like it was only 3 or 4m higher. I keep getting dragged into watching that crap because of the headlines. No more I tell you. [/rant] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 ............HOW TALL IS THE CLIMB? Anyone? ......... SAYS "Then, in November, he linked the extended track with the sit start he had done in 2006 to create a pitch that has about 110 feet of mostly horizontal roof climbing. " Hmmmmmmm SOUNDS LIKE 110'. PRETTY TALL FOR A BOULDER PROBLEM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hefeweizen Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 [rant] The system is broken and the magazines insist on perpetuating it. I keep getting dragged into watching that crap because of the headlines. No more I tell you. [/rant] That's exactly why the magazines perpetuate it. Verm's got it right. Quit grades. It's harder than smoking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choada_Boy Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 ............HOW TALL IS THE CLIMB? Anyone? ......... SAYS "Then, in November, he linked the extended track with the sit start he had done in 2006 to create a pitch that has about 110 feet of mostly horizontal roof climbing. " Hmmmmmmm SOUNDS LIKE 110'. PRETTY TALL FOR A BOULDER PROBLEM. Hmmmm... sounds like it's mostly horizontal, so unless it starts out from a cave at 100', it's pretty short. Having said that, his side-kick pad people gave me an idea: what if they protected him with a single bolt that they moved while he climbed? Would it be a boulder problem or a sport climb? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 [rant] I'm getting pretty tired of all the spray around the top grade. It's seems to me like they're really splitting hairs. The lower grades span quite a range of difficulty but all of the reasoning around the top grade sounds like 'Well I found it harder than that climb so it must deserve a higher grade.' Then someone repeats it in less time and downgrades it or doesn't say anything so that it looks like they're really that good. Grading for endurance has a double standard too. A 5.10a where each move is 5.10a is 'sustained' whereas linking a 5.14b into a 5.14c is '5.14d'? The system is broken and the magazines insist on perpetuating it. What ever happened to discussing the aesthetic of the line? I always thought it was cool that a route could have a move named after it because it was unique on the first ascent like Le Rose et le Vampire or Sharma talking about choosing to work a route because of some unique move or challenge. I watched the video of some super hard bouldering route in RMNP which was basically 2 moves. There's some super hard sport route in Rumney where the first 2 bolts were stick clipped and there was one more bolt to clip before the anchor which seemed like it was only 3 or 4m higher. I keep getting dragged into watching that crap because of the headlines. No more I tell you. [/rant] That attitude is SOOOO 2006 man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimL Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 Dani has been around the block several times. Having only met him once, but running into his climbs everywhere around here (they usually start around 8A), I can say I doubt he's media whoring any more than other sponsored climbers. If he calls it a 9b, I bet he's telling the truth. I've seen pictures of this guy soling 13b barefoot as well this guy as sent opened 5.13 crack routes. As for ratings. Over here it's a different story. Your talking about limestone. Its a different type of climbing than granite, sandstone or Smithrock tuft. Many of the routes I've done on the West Coast of the States are graded on the hardest move because they are a little more vertical and the pump issue is not that big. But on a typical Limestone route, say 7c/12d you might have three 12a crux sections in a 25 meter route that overhangs a good 10 meters. I've done many routes like this just to fall off on the last easy moves just cause I couldn't hang on any longer. On steep routes like these you have to take into account the physical nature of the route as much as the technical nature. Its a different type of climbing. Churning at Smith is a good example of this type of climbing. As for bouldering. The way they rate boulders here is with the French rating system like sport routes. Some old places go with the Font color system but I've only seen this onces in the Pyrenes. I'm only responding cause, well...cause I live here in Spain and upon first arriving here I wondered about the obvious difference between the two schools of climbing. At first I totally didn't understand. But now I can see why there is a difference. As for the grade, who cares. I'm going climbing this weekend with friends and thats all that matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hafilax Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 Those cave routes are pretty cool and I understand the pumpy nature from watching the videos. My understanding is that the route tops out the face above the entrance of the cave hence the rope, bolts and route vs. bouldering rating. I've also heard the argument that Dani is credible in assigning the grade. I just felt like ranting yesterday to prove how cool I am and to show how my maturity puts me above grades. Hard to do that by posting here though. Maybe I should practice that rant for the gym. Anyone watch that aid rant video? I thoroughly enjoyed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimL Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 Yeah, ranting can be good at times. I'm taking a couple rest days from training or really moving when I don't have to...so I have time to rant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheamclimber Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 WTF ... thats like calling the bouldering cave at my rock gym a sport climb cuz its long????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crmlla2007 Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 You'd have to put at least one hanger on it and wear a harness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frozen lifts Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Contrived? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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