tslease_19 Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Heading up to the DC on Rainier with a two man team. Just wondering what the opinions are on what distance to put between us while climbing? 30 feet? 45? Im seeing different thoughts on this both in literature and online. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ketch Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 My thoughts are; If you are going to be a 2-man team arrest and rescue is a chore. If one goes in the other must single handedly build an anchore and transfer to it while remaining in arrest. If you can do this you don't need to ask how much rope do I need. If not one should practice and determine for themselves. Â If your not up for the rescue scenario why are you getting roped up anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catbirdseat Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Well Ketch, a two man team on the DC has lots of potential assistance from other rope teams, depending on day of week and time of ascent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tslease_19 Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 At what point did I say that I wasnt capable of building an anchor and transfering to it should the need arise? I was mosty just trying to capatalize on the knowledge here and get other opinions. Nothing wrong with getting other opinions before making your own considered descion. Also, of all the routes one could do as a two man team, the DC is pretty benign. The point was made that should you get in over your head there is help available...not that I am saying you should rely on it, just if you are going to go as a two man team you could pick worse places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Anything less than a full rope length is asking for certain death. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genepires Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 It would be a good idea to give yourself more room than a team of three or more would have. You would need this extra room to allow more time to hold the fall. You would have to assume that you won't get the arrest perfect and get dragged for a while till you can get it together. With that 45 feet would seem like a good minimum. If I were to go on rainier as a team of two, with uncertain self arrest skills, 55 feet would not seem unreasonable but my look unusually long. there is a length that is too long though due to rope stretch and rope slack. typical rope spacing for a two man should allow enough rope in carried coils to allow a rappel to your partner. This means that the climbers should be at 1/3 of the rope lengths intervals. But since you are on the dc, chances are you do not need to do a self rescue and can rely on other party's to help. unless you are on everest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidHiers Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 The typical rule is to make the distance between the climbers great enough to ensure that you won't fall into the same creavase, and short enough to manage. I usually start at 1/3 and adjust from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tslease_19 Posted August 22, 2007 Author Share Posted August 22, 2007 Thanks. Thats the input I was looking for. 45 feet was what I was thinking, both to allow time to self arrest and leave enoug rope for the rescue. Hadn't thought about the issue of too much rope though due to stretch, I had only considered it from the stand point of slack when trying to manuever. Thanks all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dechristo Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 The Rule Of The Mountains (FOTH, eighth ed., pg 13) is to give your partner just enough rope to hang him(her)self. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidHiers Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 Thanks. Thats the input I was looking for. 45 feet was what I was thinking, both to allow time to self arrest and leave enoug rope for the rescue. Hadn't thought about the issue of too much rope though due to stretch, I had only considered it from the stand point of slack when trying to manuever. Thanks all  Talk about the classic tradeoff! A longer rope buys you more time to drop into self-arrest, yet more time for the fallen party to build up speed.  Sigh....  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
counterfeitfake Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 Talk about the classic tradeoff! A longer rope buys you more time to drop into self-arrest, yet more time for the fallen party to build up speed. Â Before... the other climber falls in the crevasse too? Your logic breaks down here, there's no guaranteed stop at the end of the rope. It's slack you want to avoid to keep a fallen climber from building up speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnGo Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Also, a good practice for 2 person glacier travel is to tie knots (butterfly or fig 8) every 3-4 feet in the rope between you and your partner. Â This does two things: 1) adds friction in a crevasse fall, as the knots rub and catch in the snow, to hopefully make a faster catch and thus a shorter fall, and 2) the loops can be used as points of aid to step in or pull on for the person who fell in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultragrrl Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) However, this adds an extra problem if you need to use any sort of a rescue system that isn't direct haul or if the fallen individual needs to prusik out. Edited September 5, 2007 by ultragrrl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Heading up to the DC on Rainier with a two man team. Just wondering what the opinions are on what distance to put between us while climbing? 30 feet? 45? Im seeing different thoughts on this both in literature and online. Thanks. Â at least 100 miles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetsailor Posted September 6, 2007 Share Posted September 6, 2007 Talk about the classic tradeoff! A longer rope buys you more time to drop into self-arrest, yet more time for the fallen party to build up speed. Â Before... the other climber falls in the crevasse too? Your logic breaks down here, there's no guaranteed stop at the end of the rope. It's slack you want to avoid to keep a fallen climber from building up speed. Â Note that your reply's only strictly correct if the rope is orthogonal to the crevasse. If you're paralleling the chasm, longer ropes might go for a longer ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plexus Posted September 6, 2007 Share Posted September 6, 2007 My experience with 2-person groups is to split it up in thirds, and each person carries said fraction of the rope coiled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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